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WG Please split the game we had enough of the russian crap.

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BR33K1_PAWAH #41 Posted 02 May 2019 - 06:37 PM

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:popcorn:

vixu #42 Posted 02 May 2019 - 06:37 PM

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View Postshikaka9, on 02 May 2019 - 10:19 AM, said:

WoT Community Spring ... Soon

 

Meaning some US-based company wants in on the market :D

11poseidon11 #43 Posted 02 May 2019 - 06:56 PM

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Hello,

 

This topic has been moved to off-topic sections.

 

You can follow the topic from the link below:

http://forum.worldof...m/19-off-topic/

 

11poseidon11



Hedgehog1963 #44 Posted 02 May 2019 - 07:03 PM

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View Postpihip, on 02 May 2019 - 05:23 PM, said:

I think there's some merit in OP's idea. The problem is that if we were to make a Western server, then NA would become the next problem as they will cry and whine for American tanks to be the best (those who play World of Warships should know what the NA community is capable of when it concerns American stuff).

 

No merit at all.  Players who have ground out the Soviet lines to get the tanks aren't going to sit still seeing the tanks nerfed just because of some nazi tank fanboys having cried loud enough. 

 

It's not like there's anything new in the Soviet tanks being considered strong.



Rudels_Tutor #45 Posted 02 May 2019 - 07:09 PM

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View Post11poseidon11, on 02 May 2019 - 06:56 PM, said:

Hello,

 

This topic has been moved to off-topic sections.

 

You can follow the topic from the link below:

http://forum.worldof...m/19-off-topic/

 

11poseidon11

 

lol what a troll as if it was off topic

Bordhaw #46 Posted 02 May 2019 - 07:55 PM

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View Postihateclowns, on 02 May 2019 - 09:10 AM, said:

Just grind the Russian tanks, problem solved

 

 



pihip #47 Posted 02 May 2019 - 08:27 PM

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View PostHedgehog1963, on 02 May 2019 - 07:03 PM, said:

No merit at all.  Players who have ground out the Soviet lines to get the tanks aren't going to sit still seeing the tanks nerfed just because of some nazi tank fanboys having cried loud enough. 

 

It's not like there's anything new in the Soviet tanks being considered strong.

 

Well, those who ground Type 4/5 and FV4005 are not sitting still either now that those tanks have been nerfed, yet what can you do? Send ticket to WG demanding an exp-credits-gold refund? Please.

 

Nerfs and buffs have been happening for years, people thinking "lel it won't happen to my stuff" are deluded.

No point in arguing any further if you don't see any problem with recent Soviet tanks, guess having a Tier 10 medium with mobility and gun handling of a medium yet armor and firepower of a heavy is good for the game.



Hedgehog1963 #48 Posted 02 May 2019 - 08:36 PM

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View Postpihip, on 02 May 2019 - 07:27 PM, said:

 

Well, those who ground Type 4/5 and FV4005 are not sitting still either now that those tanks have been nerfed, yet what can you do? Send ticket to WG demanding an exp-credits-gold refund? Please.

 

Nerfs and buffs have been happening for years, people thinking "lel it won't happen to my stuff" are deluded.

No point in arguing any further if you don't see any problem with recent Soviet tanks, guess having a Tier 10 medium with mobility and gun handling of a medium yet armor and firepower of a heavy is good for the game.

 

Yeah because Soviet tanks are anything like Type 4/5 OP. :sceptic:

 

There's no issue with Soviet tanks since you can get them if you want one.



pihip #49 Posted 02 May 2019 - 10:12 PM

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View PostHedgehog1963, on 02 May 2019 - 08:36 PM, said:

 

Yeah because Soviet tanks are anything like Type 4/5 OP. :sceptic:

 

There's no issue with Soviet tanks since you can get them if you want one.

 

Type 4/5 were not OP, they were broken. Before the big derp and armor buffs they were some of the worst end tier tanks in the game. After it, they became perhaps the most brainless end tier tanks in the game (one would argue most brainless tanks period, across all tiers) - armor good enough to tank gold shells and guns that do not need aiming and deal high damage (plus gold HE which were some of the most toxic gold ammo in the game along with FV4005 HESH). Now they're in some limbo where they still keep the armor, but the big derp has been nerfed to subpar effectiveness and the 14cm naval gun requires some basic gunnery skills to perform.

Still, I don't get your point about Soviet tanks. Sure, I can get one like anyone else. And then what?

VonniVidiVici #50 Posted 02 May 2019 - 10:14 PM

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Sounds like a lot more work than it's worth. They'd essentially need two dev teams for one game.

Hedgehog1963 #51 Posted 03 May 2019 - 06:25 AM

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View Postpihip, on 02 May 2019 - 09:12 PM, said:

 

Type 4/5 were not OP, they were broken. Before the big derp and armor buffs they were some of the worst end tier tanks in the game. After it, they became perhaps the most brainless end tier tanks in the game (one would argue most brainless tanks period, across all tiers) - armor good enough to tank gold shells and guns that do not need aiming and deal high damage (plus gold HE which were some of the most toxic gold ammo in the game along with FV4005 HESH). Now they're in some limbo where they still keep the armor, but the big derp has been nerfed to subpar effectiveness and the 14cm naval gun requires some basic gunnery skills to perform.

Still, I don't get your point about Soviet tanks. Sure, I can get one like anyone else. And then what?

 

If you don't get it by this point in the conversation...  I can't help you.
05:26 Added after 0 minutes

View Post1ncompetenc3, on 02 May 2019 - 09:14 PM, said:

Sounds like a lot more work than it's worth. They'd essentially need two dev teams for one game.

 

The other way of looking at it is to say for some reason that the game in the EU should have worse tanks in it than in the RU region.

Edited by Hedgehog1963, 03 May 2019 - 06:26 AM.


Jauhesammutin #52 Posted 03 May 2019 - 07:16 AM

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View Posttajj7, on 02 May 2019 - 02:44 PM, said:

 

Arties are irrelevant I don't care about them, they are their own balance mess. 

 

EBR  105 is still new and the better players mainly play it, plus players still don't deal with it well. It'll drop away over time and be similar to the T-100, a tank that quite easily can counter it. 

 

Best heavy is 260, it just is, its the one commonly asked for first in CWs and there are a lot more about than there used to be, plus loads of them are played by average or bad players, same with 907. 

 

Global win rate is a misleading stat because you have no idea how good the players playing the tank are. Global win rate says the STB-1 is much better than the IS7 and has done for year, thus showing how much of a misleading a statistic is. 

 

The IS7 has been performing poorly on global statistics for years because its so popular with the masses and is recommended as the first line for new players because its forgiving, but the tank is actually very strong after its buffs. 

 

You use win rate curves which are skill adjusted to see how tanks perform.  

 

As for your 'bad' tanks -

 

T-62A is far from bad, its just been power crept by funnily enough other Russian tanks, its obsolete because of the 430U and because of the 140 and 907s buffs, it used to be one of the strongest tier 10 meds in the game, and its hardly at the level of a Leo 1, STB-1, or 121 for example which are bad tier 10 mediums.

 

705a bad? The T110E5 would love to be as 'bad' as the 705A, it makes most players slightly over perform and is a very strong tier 10 heavy. It's also basically power crept the IS-4 because it does the sidescraping thing but with more alpha and far less weakspots. 

 

268 is not bad either, does way better than the Grille 15 for example, again it basically got powercrept by another Russian tank, i,e the bobject. 

 

K-91 is not really bad either, its an average tier 10 med down the pack from the 430U and 907, certainly again better than the 121, Leo and STB-1 for example.

 

IS-4 I'll give you, but again, power crept by other Soviet tanks, the IS7 buffs, the 277, the 430U, the 705a and the 20 basically make the IS-4 poor.

 

704, ST-I and 705, nope those are not bad, 705 is OP btw, makes most players over perform. 704 is fine and well balanced, as is ST-I, pretty much every player gets about their overall win rate or just above in those tanks.

 

430 v2, yep that is bad, but no worse than the likes of the M103, Type 61, 50120, WZ-120, WZ-132A, T54E1, and Bat Chat AP which are the main underperforming tier 9 tanks. 

 

The over performing tier 9s according to the WR curves include, Obj. 257, Obj. 705, Obj. 263, and Obj. 430, so even on the well balanced tier that tier 9 is, where more tanks are competitive, most of the Soviet tanks are either OP or strong, with only one underperforming. 

 

The situation being worst on tier 8 and 10. 

 

Generally if you look at the strongest tanks in each class on each tier, they will be Russian tanks or Russian style tanks either the best or at least in the top 2-3, hell in some classes they fill pretty much the top 3 spots. 

 

As others have mentioned go down the tiers a bit and they are less stand out but you still have stuff like the T-34-85M and the SU-100M1, which are OP lower tier tanks. 

 

When you look at strong performers and popularity, its pretty clear over recent years the balance has shifted to Russian tanks, clearly to placate the biggest playerbase in the game. 

 

 

 
Arties are relevant. They are part of the game. Actually they are so relevant that they just got a nerf.
Global winrate is also relevant. The game is balanced around all players. Both 40% bots and 60% unicums drive the same IS-7.
Rewards tanks like 907 are irrelevant. Those aren't available for everybody and as they are rewards the should be better than normal tanks.
 
The tanks I listed are all bad.You don't think they are bad because the gap is so small (7% as previously said).
 
Winrate curves are pretty useless. Comparing the most recent played tank's winrate to the overall winrate doesn't make any sense. My overall winrate consist of first T1-T10 grind, stock tanks, stock crews, trial and error and so on.
 
I have a 70% winrate in my WZ-132-1 (most recent played T10). So am I over performing by 10%? Nope. During the last 1000 battles my winrate was 68% and during the last year 66%.
Overall winrate on a tank is much better as it accounts all the players and how a certain tank performs against all players. Also this can be flawed (only few games played) as you pointed out with the STB-1.
 
Bottom tier is a mess of it's own and it belongs in another discussion. There are multiple OP tanks, mostly non-Russian.
 
If one cries about Russian BIAS then the best answer is to play Russian tanks. If I can't beat a game I'll choose an easier difficulty. If I want to tryhard and bang my head against the wall I choose the hardest difficulty.
Same goes with WoT. Play the worst tank if you want to challenge yourself or play the easiest if you want to win.
 
Have you ever played rock paper scissors? Is it fun? Do you feel like you are winning? Evenly balance out all tanks and that's the game we'll get. Tanks A beats tank B and tank B beats tank C and tank C beats tank A.
 
Look at clan games.
EBR is used for scouting
GCG/T92 as an arty
Russian meds /heavies as pushing force
STRV as a sniper.
S.Conq as a hulldown warrior
Every tank has a specific role and that team couldn't work without all of them.

Edited by Jauhesammutin, 03 May 2019 - 07:30 AM.


pihip #53 Posted 03 May 2019 - 08:10 AM

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View PostHedgehog1963, on 03 May 2019 - 06:25 AM, said:

If you don't get it by this point in the conversation...  I can't help you.


You don't think Soviet tanks are a problem, and I disagree - I hope that much is clear by now. It's not yet reached "soviet bias" territory (unpopular and/or subpar lines like Object 705A and K-91 are Soviet after all), and I hope it never will, but I still worry a bit.

But I won't press the matter further, have fun and good day to you.
 



XxKuzkina_MatxX #54 Posted 03 May 2019 - 09:43 AM

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View Postpihip, on 03 May 2019 - 11:10 AM, said:

You don't think Soviet tanks are a problem, and I disagree - I hope that much is clear by now. It's not yet reached "soviet bias" territory (unpopular and/or subpar lines like Object 705A and K-91 are Soviet after all), and I hope it never will, but I still worry a bit.

But I won't press the matter further, have fun and good day to you.

 

Awesome, found another polite one and good day to you sir! :)

Gremlin182 #55 Posted 03 May 2019 - 11:36 AM

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There are more players on the RU servers than on the EU probably more than all the other Servers combined.

They are going to create a game that pleases that market.



pihip #56 Posted 04 May 2019 - 10:50 AM

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View PostXxKuzkina_MatxX, on 03 May 2019 - 09:43 AM, said:

 

Awesome, found another polite one and good day to you sir! :)


Thanks, I guess? :B
 

View PostGremlin182, on 03 May 2019 - 11:36 AM, said:

There are more players on the RU servers than on the EU probably more than all the other Servers combined.

They are going to create a game that pleases that market.

 

This.

 

Don't remember where, but I have this memory that the RU playerbase is, in fact, larger than the playerbase of the other servers combined.

 

So yes, from a company standpoint it makes sense for WG to cater to their largest customer.

 

Still, there have been exceptions. AFAIK not even RU was happy when the Object 263 line was redone and Object 268 v4 was added, yet WG went with it anyway.



Geoffrey_Ironfist #57 Posted 05 May 2019 - 07:02 PM

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Russian tanks are not good all round, unless all-round means armour and alpha. My

View Posttajj7, on 02 May 2019 - 03:44 PM, said:

 

Part of the issue is the general direction of making many of these Soviet tanks just too damn all round good at everything, not sacrificing enough in say armour or mobility or firepower to allow other tanks to flourish.

 

It is not true that tier for tier Russian tanks are better. In the end you practically only discuss tier X Russian tanks, of which I do not have any and cannot comment and then you dismiss other tier X tanks like the EBR and bad Russian arty because they do not fit your picture. And it is not a dumb point to play them if you think they are better, why is that dumb? If you think they give you an advantage play them, it would be dumb not to.

 

I posted earlier my views on my Russian tanks: they are among the worst tanks in my garage - see my post above. They are NOT good all rounders, because compared to French or German tanks their only consistent advantage is armour and alpha, that's it, nothing else, they are very often inferior in every other statistic. They are all round average, or rather all round sub-par, except for armour and alpha.

 

EDIT: I came across this post which I hope settles it: http://forum.wotblit...cs-best-nation/

According to this analysis from 2016, Russia is actually BY FAR the worst nation up to tier IV, tops tier VIII and is balanced at tiers IX-X.


Edited by Geoffrey_Ironfist, 07 May 2019 - 05:52 PM.






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