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Israel in game


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WotPizza #1 Posted 02 May 2019 - 01:16 PM

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Please wargaming put Israel in the tech tree as new nation. 

TheJumpMaster #2 Posted 02 May 2019 - 01:25 PM

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View PostWotPizza, on 02 May 2019 - 02:16 PM, said:

Please wargaming put Israel in the tech tree as new nation. 

 

This is thread 1,903 on this subject. Please use the search function.

DA_ZOHAN #3 Posted 02 May 2019 - 01:33 PM

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I second this notion, and soundly reject post #2 and all others like it.

TheJumpMaster #4 Posted 02 May 2019 - 01:34 PM

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View PostDA_ZOHAN, on 02 May 2019 - 02:33 PM, said:

I second this notion, and soundly reject post #2 and all others like it.

 

What, you object to the OP using the search function??? This is quite strange.

DA_ZOHAN #5 Posted 02 May 2019 - 01:39 PM

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Aaron, I think that you know exactly what I am talking about, and I find it amusing that you are trying to take this in a well known & tread path.

 

BTW, your comment on 1903 threads on Israeli tanks is false.

I put in a search using the key words: "Israeli Tanks"  it yielded 315 results.

http://forum.worldof...h&fromMainBar=1

 


Edited by DA_ZOHAN, 02 May 2019 - 01:41 PM.


Japualtah #6 Posted 02 May 2019 - 01:42 PM

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Israel didn't exist during WWII and developed their first armament at a period inadequate to this game.

There is another game which will fulfill your expectations though, you'll find it easily.



DA_ZOHAN #7 Posted 02 May 2019 - 01:49 PM

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View PostJapualtah, on 02 May 2019 - 02:42 PM, said:

Israel didn't exist during WWII and developed their first armament at a period inadequate to this game.

There is another game which will fulfill your expectations though, you'll find it easily.

 

That is a weak argument.  There is only a restriction on how modern tanks can be in WoT in order to avoid smoothbore guns and composite armor which would decimate any and all tanks and be impervious to all guns.

Israel used Hotchkiss tanks for the tier 2 minimum, and tier 1's are cut and paste in several nations anyway, and who cares about tier 1 at all other then seal clubbers...



Kozzy #8 Posted 02 May 2019 - 01:57 PM

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Has Israel independently developed a single tank that would be suitable for this game?  Should all minor nations that used other nations' tanks have their own tech tree?  Where do you draw the line?

DA_ZOHAN #9 Posted 02 May 2019 - 02:14 PM

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View PostKozzy, on 02 May 2019 - 02:57 PM, said:

Has Israel independently developed a single tank that would be suitable for this game?  Should all minor nations that used other nations' tanks have their own tech tree?  Where do you draw the line?

 

I have said this in the past, there is a finite number of nations in the world that had/have a tank industry.  Thus there is a finite number of real tanks, real prototypes, & real concepts that fit into the World of Tanks timeline.  

I 100% support the concept of the cutoff, which was mid 70's time wise, and technology wise.

Thus what we are left with is the advent of a Rest of the World tech tree once all nations that can fill a full tech tree are featured.  Israel is one of the nations that would be featured in a rest of the world tech tree in my opinion. 

 

Regarding your just question regarding independent development, only 1 tank from Israel is 100% home grown, the Merkava.  3 Variants of this tank fit the WoT timeline.

1. The Prototype

2. Mk1.

3, Mk2. (had modifications for HEAT protection in the rear of the turret in the form of metal chains that would detonate the charge before hitting the massive weakspot in the rear of the turret, as well as improved handling of secondary weapons such as the 60mm mortar and remotely operated machine gun.)

The Mk3 already had technology that makes it too modern for the game.


Edited by DA_ZOHAN, 02 May 2019 - 02:20 PM.


DuncaN_101 #10 Posted 02 May 2019 - 02:14 PM

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Here we go again... Whooo

DA_ZOHAN #11 Posted 02 May 2019 - 02:18 PM

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View PostDuncaN_101, on 02 May 2019 - 03:14 PM, said:

Here we go again... Whooo

 

I do not understand why you or anyone else should have a problem with this thread or any other like it, be it Israeli or Romanian or Hungarian or Turkish or South Korean or whatever.

It is an open forum, and this is a discussion about potential extra content for the game.  It baffles me that people here have a problem with this.



Kozzy #12 Posted 02 May 2019 - 02:21 PM

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View PostDA_ZOHAN, on 02 May 2019 - 01:14 PM, said:

 

...Thus what we are left with is the advent of a Rest of the World tech tree once all nations that can fill a full tech tree are featured.  Israel is one of the nations that would be featured in a rest of the world tech tree in my opinion. 

 

 

I would actually support this 100%.  'Rest of world' tree would be fine, may have to make special concessions regarding tank crews etc.

 

View PostDA_ZOHAN, on 02 May 2019 - 01:14 PM, said:

Regarding your just question regarding independent development, only 1 tank from Israel is 100% home grown, the Merkava.  3 Variants of this tank fit the WoT timeline.

1. The Prototype

2. Mk1.

3, Mk2.

 

 

I had assumed all Merkavas had smooth bore guns, I may have been wrong it seems.



Isharial #13 Posted 02 May 2019 - 02:22 PM

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View PostDA_ZOHAN, on 02 May 2019 - 02:18 PM, said:

 

I do not understand why you or anyone else should have a problem with this thread or any other like it, be it Israeli or Romanian or Hungarian or Turkish or South Korean or whatever.

It is an open forum, and this is a discussion about potential extra content for the game.  It baffles me that people here have a problem with this.

 

as to the thread, the OP has put nothing to discuss or even talk about beyond "do you want Israel in game or not". there is nothing else. some will, some wont, but beyond that there is nothing.

 

as to your comment, Israel was formed *after* ww2, and therefore had no indigenous tanks within the period that WG are currently working in. The Merkava would be far too advanced for WoT in its current iteration and therefore said tech tree would be made up of copy paste tanks such as elderly Shermans and AMX 13's, of which we already have in the game and in regards to the Sherman, many variants of it.

 

we don't need more of the same.


Edited by Isharial, 02 May 2019 - 02:23 PM.


DA_ZOHAN #14 Posted 02 May 2019 - 02:23 PM

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View PostKozzy, on 02 May 2019 - 03:21 PM, said:

 

I would actually support this 100%.  'Rest of world' tree would be fine, may have to make special concessions regarding tank crews etc.

 

 

I had assumed all Merkavas had smooth bore guns, I may have been wrong it seems.

The Mk3 already had a 120mm smoothbore that could fire atgms as well.

The Mk 1 and 2 had the all conquering 105mm L7.



pecopad #15 Posted 02 May 2019 - 02:27 PM

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Judging from what they do to the British tanks, I think its better not to have an Israeli tree, they would probably suck

 

I have no problems with new countries,maybe and Iraquian/Iranian/Egytian/Korean, etc Probably better to have a new line with tanks from all the nations (South Africa has some interesting tanks) UN tanks, would be nice.

 

I would love to see the UN cammo possible for all tanks.


Edited by pecopad, 02 May 2019 - 02:28 PM.


DA_ZOHAN #16 Posted 02 May 2019 - 02:27 PM

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View PostIsharial, on 02 May 2019 - 03:22 PM, said:

 

as to the thread, the OP has put nothing to discuss or even talk about beyond "do you want Israel in game or not". there is nothing else. some will, some wont, but beyond that there is nothing.

 

as to your comment, Israel was formed *after* ww2, and therefore had no indigenous tanks within the period that WG are currently working in. The Merkava would be far too advanced for WoT in its current iteration and therefore said tech tree would be made up of copy paste tanks such as elderly Shermans and AMX 13's, of which we already have in the game and in regards to the Sherman, many variants of it.

 

we don't need more of the same.

 

Learn to read.  There are 3 variants that do fit the timeline and technology cutoff.

Mk 3 and Mk4 are tier 11 and 12 candidates for certain.

 

Beyond that, your comment of ""we don't need more of the same"' is quite arrogant.  You can speak for yourself, your opinion is your own, and you have every right to it, no matter what it is.

I have my opinion, and everyone here has theirs.  More content in the game is a net positive.  Nothing bad can happen from it.  If you do not want to play a line for whatever reason, don't.  That doesn't mean that others should not be able to if they chose to.



Balc0ra #17 Posted 02 May 2019 - 02:30 PM

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View PostDA_ZOHAN, on 02 May 2019 - 02:14 PM, said:

 

I have said this in the past, there is a finite number of nations in the world that had/have a tank industry.  Thus there is a finite number of real tanks, real prototypes, & real concepts that fit into the World of Tanks timeline.  

I 100% support the concept of the cutoff, which was mid 70's time wise, and technology wise.

 

They used Hotchkiss, way after France did stop using them indeed. As they have had Shermans, M10's, AMX 13's, Cent 1, M46, M60... You name it. As tanks they used within the time period this game goes for, are already in the game for a majority of the tiers or lines they would fit in if you will. And thus why WG have said it won't appear. As they don't want more copy cat tech trees. Even if there would be a few unique stuff in there on higher tiers, it would be less so on low and mid tiers. As even their own Israeli modified Cent is more or less a 7/1. Thus last WG was asked about it. They did not consider it due to that.

 

Tho... there is still the posibility of a hybrid nation tech tree, if that idea has not died out for WG. As I suspect that's your best bet. For all the Hybrids they have made that would be interesting. We already have one in the game. And considering how many more Super Sherman variants they made, and how many parts they swapped between Shermans and AMX 13 tanks, from guns to turrets etc. Or even their WWII used M10's that got worn down so fast, they had Sherman engines and 17 prd or AMX 13 guns fitted on them iirc. If not for a tech tree. There are some premium tank potentials in there. 


Edited by Balc0ra, 02 May 2019 - 02:32 PM.


DA_ZOHAN #18 Posted 02 May 2019 - 02:30 PM

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View Postpecopad, on 02 May 2019 - 03:27 PM, said:

Judging from what they do to the British tanks, I think its better not to have an Israeli tree, they would probably suck

 

I have no problems with new countries,maybe and Iraquian/Iranian/Egytian/Korean, etc Probably better to have a new line with tanks from all the nations (South Africa has some interesting tanks) UN tanks, would be nice.

 

I would love to see the UN cammo possible for all tanks.

 

So better not to have Israeli tanks because of what WG has done to UK tanks, but a copy paste of other nations that have not even modified a tank to their own specifications (except S Korea in your example) is ok.

Interesting.

13:32 Added after 1 minute

View PostBalc0ra, on 02 May 2019 - 03:30 PM, said:

 

 

They used Hotchkiss, way after France did stop using them indeed. As they have had Shermans, M10's, AMX 13's, Cent 1, M46, M60... You name it. As tanks they used within the time period this game goes for, are already in the game for a majority of the tiers or lines they would fit in if you will. And thus why WG have said it won't appear. As they don't want more copy cat tech trees. Even if there would be a few unique stuff in there on higher tiers, it would be less so on low and mid tiers. As even their own Israeli modified Cent is more or less a 7/1. Thus last WG was asked about it. They did not consider it due to that.

 

Tho... there is still the posibility of a hybrid nation tech tree, if that idea has not died out for WG. As I suspect that's your best be. For all the Hybrids they have made that would be interesting. We already have one in the game. And considering how many more super Sherman variants they made, and how many parts they swapped between Shermans and AMX 13 tanks, from guns to turrets etc. Or even their WWII used M10's that got worn down so fast, they had Sherman engines and 17 prd or AMX 13 guns fitted on them iirc. If not for a tech tree. There are some premium tank potentials in there. 

 

Well, when the time comes where they cannot expand current nation tech trees any further, or even close to that time comes, we shall see wont we.

pecopad #19 Posted 02 May 2019 - 02:32 PM

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View PostDA_ZOHAN, on 02 May 2019 - 02:27 PM, said:

 

Learn to read.  There are 3 variants that do fit the timeline and technology cutoff.

Mk 3 and Mk4 are tier 11 and 12 candidates for certain.

 

Beyond that, your comment of ""we don't need more of the same"' is quite arrogant.  You can speak for yourself, your opinion is your own, and you have every right to it, no matter what it is.

I have my opinion, and everyone here has theirs.  More content in the game is a net positive.  Nothing bad can happen from it.  If you do not want to play a line for whatever reason, don't.  That doesn't mean that others should not be able to if they chose to.

 

More content,makes it harder to balance the existing content.

 

I think we get very little from having tech trees with only one tank like, like the Italian, Check or Polish... The Block in the missions are a good idea. Maybe group tank trees of this nations, and crew requirements.

 

And by the way, I have no problem with an Israeli line,more is better, my only problem is that I collect tanks and need to develop crews for all this nations.

 

Regarding nations... well Saudi Arabia has more tanks than most nations in the game, except for Russia, US and China and they don't get a line...

 

Turkey could also be another Arab nation...


Edited by pecopad, 02 May 2019 - 02:38 PM.


Isharial #20 Posted 02 May 2019 - 02:38 PM

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View PostDA_ZOHAN, on 02 May 2019 - 02:27 PM, said:

 

Learn to read.  There are 3 variants that do fit the timeline and technology cutoff.

Mk 3 and Mk4 are tier 11 and 12 candidates for certain.

 

Beyond that, your comment of ""we don't need more of the same"' is quite arrogant.  You can speak for yourself, your opinion is your own, and you have every right to it, no matter what it is.

I have my opinion, and everyone here has theirs.  More content in the game is a net positive.  Nothing bad can happen from it.  If you do not want to play a line for whatever reason, don't.  That doesn't mean that others should not be able to if they chose to.

 

3 variants doesn't constitute and entire line though. what would you fill the rest of the line with? a Russian med and a few French tanks that are already within their original tree's? im all for adding new nations but that isn't the way to go about it.

 

as to the rest, :facepalm:do you know what arrogant actually means? I am far from it posting my *opinion* on a thread where you explicitly state you want to be able to post your *opinion*. that is highly ironic of you, and shows what your truly after, which is neither Israel as a nation, nor a discussion.

your simply after a fight and that's the sole reason as to why your talking like this. there's no reason to quote a post and then go on the full offensive front when you couldn't even be bothered to read it.

 

hell, your first 3 words were "Learn to read", except my comment was posted *before* the others actually appeared in the thread (I was reading it and typing before they were even posted, so yeah), and as I said, 3 tanks doesn't make a line up of 10, neither can the prototype Merkava work properly at T8 with the 105mm L7 gun that majorly sits at TX, or, on the charioteer, which is not only a TD but has paper thin armour and a slow traverse. its neither heavy nor capable of brawling, unlike what the Merkava would be. 

 

everyone has the right to an opinion, no one has the right to dismiss and then attack another person's opinion because it doesn't match thiers. that is what a discussion is for, sadly im not sure you understand that.

 

 

 






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