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Medium Tanks Rebalance (Supertest): Second Iteration


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vuque #1 Posted 03 May 2019 - 04:49 PM

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Hello Commanders,
 

The first Supertest iteration for the re-balanced medium tanks is over, and we would like to share the results with you.
 

Our plans to re-balance some MTs prompted a heated discussion within the community. We totally agree this is a very important matter for many of you as the proposed changes concern Tier X vehicles—the prized ones which one doesn’t get in a day or two. Even positive adjustments to top-tier vehicles may impact the motivation to invest in their research. That’s why we do our best to inform you about every change beforehand.
 

Now we’ll describe some additional adjustments to the MTs in more detail, and will also explain what we intend to achieve. It should be noted that two of the five vehicles we mentioned before, the Object 430 and the Object 430U, will stay intact for now.
 

Please take note that all changes are currently being Supertested, and the stats may be further tweaked during the next iterations. The final stats of the tanks involved will be defined only before the release.
 

Leopard 1
 

From its inception, we envisioned this tank as a mobile sniper able to swiftly react to the battle dynamic and lend support to allies while staying far from the enemy. A good sniper needs a quality gun, so we concentrated our efforts on the tank’s armament. After two closed test iterations, we boosted a range of its parameters, including accuracy, stabilization, armor penetration, and shell velocity.
 

The APCR will continue to be the basic round of Leopard 1 and will travel at a speed of 1,480 meters per second. During the tests, we came to the conclusion that keeping this shell type best suits the tank’s role (a long-range striker). The new special shell will be an ACPR, too (as we told you before), but its armor penetration will be improved even further, up to 323 mm. Its velocity of 1,613 meters per second will make it one of the fastest rounds currently in the game. The increased gun accuracy of 0.29 makes the Leopard 1 the most precise shooter among all Tier X medium tanks.
 

If the testing goes well, the operators of the Leopard 1 will be able to choose between two kinds of APCRs, both with fine stats. On top of that, these rounds’ armor penetration stays high at long range.
 

But that’s not all. We plan to test the improved stabilization which will amount to 0.13 both on the move and while taking a turn (approximately 28% better than the stabilization on the main server now). Together with the short aiming time of 1.7 seconds, this will let the Leopard 1 get ready for firing much faster.
 

The Leopard 1 will get these modifications now, and if these are up to our expectations, the tank will become the ultimate mobile sniper. By increasing the alpha, the accuracy, and the stabilization, we’re fine-tuning the top German for comfortable play in its redefined role. High shell velocity and armor penetration will allow damaging an opponent even from afar. Of course, the vulnerabilities shall stay: the armor won’t thicken, still being almost a ‘placeholder’ one. Please keep that in mind: a true sniper should be very cautious!

 

STB-1
 

Currently, the STB-1 is a generic tank which plays pretty well at mid-range but lacks a unique style. We intend to create one—by introducing a very peculiar feature plus significantly boosting the stats, to make it a formidable close-to-mid-range fighter.
 

The said feature is a hydro-pneumatic suspension the tankers have kept asking for—because the real-world STB-1 had one. Thanks to this mechanic, the Japanese will be able to tilt its hull, increasing its effective gun depression. The suspension will switch on automatically, just like on the new Swedish medium tanks. The total gun depression will increase from 10 to 12 degrees. Because of the introduction of a new mechanic the ‘tilt input’ will be split 50/50: 6 degrees at the expense of the hull and 6 degrees at the expense of the gun. Should we get positive test results, the STB-1 will be able to use terrain folds to maximal efficiency, hitting its enemies at extreme angles from unexpected directions.
 

We’re also going to test the second important adjustment: a boost to turret protection. For the STB-1 to keep it together in a brawl, we’ll do the following:
 

  • Get rid of weak armor zones in the gun mantlet
  • Increase the mantlet armor thickness
  • Bolster the overall frontal turret protection
     

After such a complex upgrade to the turret’s armor, the STB-1 will cope with enemy strikes much better. Together with the new suspension, this will strengthen the tank’s terrain-based play. The Japanese medium will be able to dish out damage reliably while surviving multiple hits.
 

“Reliable” is the best word describing the damage dealing capacity of the STB-1, as the third essential change to the tank is the increased damage per minute. While the alpha will go down, the DPM will grow even more compared to the first Supertest iteration. Due to reloading time decreased from 7.3 to 7.1 seconds, the DPM will cross the 3,000 threshold, reaching an awesome height of 3,042 points of damage which is the second best for the Tier X medium tanks. Besides that, the STB-1 will keep its improved gun stabilization from the first testing phase. Due to the combination of all these factors—the increased DPM, better stabilization, and the introduction of an AP shell—the tank will be able to shoot more often while sustaining high DPM.
 

The changes to the velocity of the rounds should be addressed separately. During the Supertest, the APCR shell will be substituted by an AP one. This entails a speed decrease, but after the first testing phase, we decided not to make it drastic (from the current 1478 to 1185 meters per second). Thus, both rounds (basic and special) are in fact becoming slower. Still, due to the changes to the STB-1 tactical role, the velocity of its rounds ceases to be a very important parameter. The tank will excel at close-to-mid-range combat, using its hydro-pneumatic suspension and also its improved turret armor, DPM, and gun stabilization. AP rounds will normalize better, increasing the chance to penetrate enemy armor.
 

AMX 30B
 

We’d like to run one more test iteration for this one with its stats unchanged, so it will transition to the next stage as it is.
 

The Conclusion
 

Re-balancing Tier X vehicles aren’t easy, and that’s why the closed test consists of many steps. Not all the tweaks make it into the release; those bringing needed results get into the Common test where you can probe them yourselves. Our objective is to make these tanks more diverse gameplay-wise, and also more efficient in their respective tactical roles. We want every player to be able to find a tank that suits them most and have fun fighting in it while using its potential to the fullest.
 

Once again: please remember that all the changes we’ve mentioned are in closed test now, and the tanks’ stats may change when a new stage starts. The final parameters will be defined just before the release.



xx984 #2 Posted 03 May 2019 - 06:44 PM

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and the 430U and 430? While the first changes are being revised it would be nice to see what you guys think you want to do with those tanks instead. 

DaddysLittlePrincess #3 Posted 03 May 2019 - 07:10 PM

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Just for the record. Hydro-pneumatic suspension on STB-1 is not necessary a buff. -12 degrees might sound good, but it's depression only on the front of the tank and it gets only -6 on sides (which I personally find very important).  

TheDrownedApe #4 Posted 03 May 2019 - 07:15 PM

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Every day that goes by i become more apathetic towards the "positive" changes the developers try and make.

 

The RU bias is not even humorous anymore and just shows how WG don't want to alienate their biggest following, even if it is to the detriment of the game.

 

 



Hezs #5 Posted 03 May 2019 - 07:54 PM

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Leopard 1 changes sound good. So it has 278 apcr and 323 apcr special rounds now with 420 damage?

What is the hp/t value now? I suggest not to lower hp/t so that it could actually reach the 70km/h top speed.


Edited by Hezs, 03 May 2019 - 07:55 PM.


Paul_Kouadio #6 Posted 03 May 2019 - 09:03 PM

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Leopard 1 changes are looking good (finally moving toward being a worthy reward for the grind). I really want to get some more information on the concerned medium branches themselves, e.g. the tier VIII and IX (or the entire branch in the case of the Leopard).

ToodlePips #7 Posted 03 May 2019 - 09:34 PM

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View Postvuque, on 03 May 2019 - 03:49 PM, said:

 On top of that, these rounds’ armor penetration stays high at long range.

 

Does it, though? What about normalization? These are APCR shells, after all. Also, if you want to make the Leopard the 'ultimate mobile sniper', how is it that the standard shells have a slower shell speed than, say, those of the Object 907 (which is a much more versatile and hands-down superior tank anyway). I am not convinced.

Well, at least the dispersion on the move has been improved further. That's something, I guess.



Desyatnik_Pansy #8 Posted 03 May 2019 - 09:51 PM

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View Postvuque, on 03 May 2019 - 04:49 PM, said:

The APCR will continue to be the basic round of Leopard 1 and will travel at a speed of 1,480 meters per second.

 

Am I the only one who would've preferred to keep the new AP Standard shell? :hiding:



leggasiini #9 Posted 03 May 2019 - 10:05 PM

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STB-1 changes look better for sure, especially happy that some of the unnecessary changes to the STB-1 like the ridiculous accuracy and top speed nerf are now gone. Basically it now gains a better turret, drastically better handling, AP instead of APCR, more gun depression with the suspension, and bit higher DPM, for reduced alpha, shell velocity and it's overall a bit more clunky. Sounds like a fair trade-off, though I want to see how much the turret armor buff affects the vehicle. 

 

Leo 1 changes also look even better now, interesting to see how that tank will perform.

 

30 B changes already looked good in my eyes so glad to see that the changes have remained.

 

Overall looks like an improvement over the 1st phase. Now if only you re-considered nerfing the Object 430 and 430U. If not guns, maybe tackle their armor instead...

 

 



LordSkyFury #10 Posted 03 May 2019 - 10:14 PM

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View PostDesyatnik_Pansy, on 03 May 2019 - 09:51 PM, said:

 

Am I the only one who would've preferred to keep the new AP Standard shell? :hiding:

 

I was really happy with high velocity AP too, because of better normalization.
21:23 Added after 8 minutes
Looking good, only thing I am worried are STB-1 changes. I really like current version of STB-1(and I am probably alone) because of its characteristics which are great for my playstyle and siege mode will take my favorite -10° on sides which I am using a lot. I have really mixed feelings. Well we will see on commont test if this will make my STB just decoration in garage. Is there any chance old STB-1 will became reward tank? After all it is huge change like for Foch 155.

MeNoobTank #11 Posted 03 May 2019 - 10:56 PM

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@vuque please, just please could you tell the devs about the 121 chinese line ? They really forgot about it. From tier 8 they are all the worst in class for every tier.

 

Other than that, these changes look very nice from my perspective.



KanonenVogel19 #12 Posted 04 May 2019 - 12:46 AM

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Regarding the Leopard 1:

 

- Please keep the AP round as you suggested before, but give it 1480 m/s velocity so that it can snipe efficiently. It doesn't seem that you go by any realistic formulas for shell velocity so there shouldn't be any problem with having a 1480 m/s AP round.

 

- An accuracy of 0.29 is not enough, it will not make any difference in practice. Please buff it futher to somewhere around 0.20-0.25 accuracy.

 

- What about the improved penetration (278 mm) of the standard rounds? That was a good buff, so I hope you keep that?

 

- What about the compensational nerfs you suggested before, such as longer reload and slower traverse? Please don't proceed with those changes as they're not required, the Leopard 1 will not be OP even if you don't apply these nerfs.

 

Regarding the STB-1:

 

- It's very good that you will give it better turret armor.

 

- Please don't nerf the accuracy, 0.37 accuracy is not appropriate for a tier 10 low alpha gun, it's too much RNG.

 

Regarding the Obj.430 and Obj.430U:

 

- Please give some information regarding these tanks aswell. Why where the nerfs cancelled? Will there be any new nerfs? When?



eaxnml #13 Posted 04 May 2019 - 01:29 AM

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Turn on english  subtitles.    



MrEdweird #14 Posted 04 May 2019 - 02:29 PM

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View Postleggasiini, on 03 May 2019 - 09:05 PM, said:

STB-1 changes look better for sure, especially happy that some of the unnecessary changes to the STB-1 like the ridiculous accuracy and top speed nerf are now gone. Basically it now gains a better turret, drastically better handling, AP instead of APCR, more gun depression with the suspension, and bit higher DPM, for reduced alpha, shell velocity and it's overall a bit more clunky. Sounds like a fair trade-off, though I want to see how much the turret armor buff affects the vehicle. 

 

Leo 1 changes also look even better now, interesting to see how that tank will perform.

 

30 B changes already looked good in my eyes so glad to see that the changes have remained.

 

Overall looks like an improvement over the 1st phase. Now if only you re-considered nerfing the Object 430 and 430U. If not guns, maybe tackle their armor instead...

 

 

 

Are we sure they're not keeping the speed/power/accuracy changes on the STB-1? Also, I don't think the accuracy change will have any effect at all in the intended role.

Edited by MrEdweird, 04 May 2019 - 02:30 PM.


K1Lc4m #15 Posted 04 May 2019 - 02:33 PM

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View Postvuque, on 03 May 2019 - 04:49 PM, said:

Now we’ll describe some additional adjustments to the MTs in more detail, and will also explain what we intend to achieve. It should be noted that two of the five vehicles we mentioned before, the Object 430 and the Object 430U, will stay intact for now.

 

View Postleggasiini, on 03 May 2019 - 10:05 PM, said:

STB-1 changes look better for sure, especially happy that some of the unnecessary changes to the STB-1 like the ridiculous accuracy and top speed nerf are now gone. Basically it now gains a better turret, drastically better handling, AP instead of APCR, more gun depression with the suspension, and bit higher DPM, for reduced alpha, shell velocity and it's overall a bit more clunky. Sounds like a fair trade-off, though I want to see how much the turret armor buff affects the vehicle. 

 

Leo 1 changes also look even better now, interesting to see how that tank will perform.

 

30 B changes already looked good in my eyes so glad to see that the changes have remained.

 

Overall looks like an improvement over the 1st phase. Now if only you re-considered nerfing the Object 430 and 430U. If not guns, maybe tackle their armor instead...

 

 

This is additional change, so the presented stats above are only changes of the first iteration. The STB-1 are gonna keep accuracy and top speed nerf.

5everin #16 Posted 04 May 2019 - 02:51 PM

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Well they finally addressed the actual problem with the Leo, garbage soft stats on the gun.

 

"if the testing goes well, the operators of the Leopard 1 will be able to choose between two kinds of APCRs, both with fine stats. On top of that, these rounds’ armor penetration stays high at long range."

 

If that bit is actually the case the Leo will be an effective sniper, now all we need is some more maps that allow good snipers to operate.


Edited by 5everin, 04 May 2019 - 02:51 PM.


katapult20 #17 Posted 04 May 2019 - 05:32 PM

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Why would you still nerf the accuracy and top speed on the STB-1? As if 0.36 acc. and 52km/h top speed are 'too high'... even with these improvement changes, the tank will be mediocre at best.

WindSplitter1 #18 Posted 04 May 2019 - 06:24 PM

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View Posteaxnml, on 04 May 2019 - 12:29 AM, said:

Turn on english  subtitles.    

 

So true...

Go Russian or go home.



K1Lc4m #19 Posted 04 May 2019 - 06:57 PM

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View Postkatapult20, on 04 May 2019 - 05:32 PM, said:

Why would you still nerf the accuracy and top speed on the STB-1? As if 0.36 acc. and 52km/h top speed are 'too high'... even with these improvement changes, the tank will be mediocre at best.

 

note that with the buff in the first iteration, the STB-1 will be a beast for snapshot, so lose 0.01 don't gonnat be so noticeable in my opinion, especially as it will be made for the short and medium range.

prohunter00 #20 Posted 04 May 2019 - 10:59 PM

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WG, what about 121 and other chinese tanks? Also, in trying to create the perfect sniper(Leo 1), what about K-91?

You can at least give it fully rotatable turret. I can't remember when i last saw one on the battlefield. 


Edited by prohunter00, 04 May 2019 - 11:00 PM.





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