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I just unlocked the FV4005...

Its useless

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Vela_ZG #1 Posted 05 May 2019 - 02:03 PM

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I trained the crew, got all the good equipment mounted, even the directives, everything... This thing is such a disappointment after Conway it's ridiculous, and the Conway didn't even have the upgraded tracks and engine researched so I could get to this thing quicker. FV4005 has absolutely horrific mobility, especially backwards, I mean it cannot escape, not one, but two hits after it fired. It has no armor and no camo! The gun aimes and reloads so slowly it's useless unless you're preaimed at a certain point and lucky. The grille got hit hard when it was nerfed, but this thing is on another level. Seriously, how does WG think anyone would be pleased with this game after researching the entire line only to get to something completely useless? I only played three games in it so I'm not frustrated, I'm not angry, I just don't understand. This tank needs to be removed from the tree. Imagine having NO mobility, NO camo, No armor, and a bad gun! Hahahahahh! Plus the thing is as big as a house! And, a cherry on top: Not fully traversable turret! :teethhappy:

Nishi_Kinuyo #2 Posted 05 May 2019 - 02:04 PM

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Why you think people call it the shitbarn?

7thSyndicate #3 Posted 05 May 2019 - 02:15 PM

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here we go again

Dorander #4 Posted 05 May 2019 - 02:22 PM

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The FV4005 was broken before last patch, and rather than fix the thing that made it broken, Wargaming decided the broken part was the key thing about the tank that made it "unique" and in order to "balance" it they broke it even more. If you can't manage to remain unspotted when you send someone back to the garage it's a two-way punishment system.

 

It's one of the main reasons I avoid tier 10 and instead vastly prefer tier 9. The tanks are simply less extreme, and this game is at its most fun when you have the opportunity to try multiple things in order to defeat the enemies on a flank who will be trying to do the same, not when you get your entire game ended because of a single mistake. The alpha powercreep, the overdone armour profiles, all it does is make game results more spikey and frequently faster. A bounce or a pen is a 100% scenario, a lower alpha that has a good chance to pen unless your opponent counters makes for an engaging battle.



friedeggnchips #5 Posted 05 May 2019 - 02:24 PM

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Vela_ZG #6 Posted 05 May 2019 - 02:47 PM

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Don't get me wrong, I'm not whining about this thing being a disappointment. I just won't play it, no big deal. What I don't understand is how WG can make such a mistake. It's a ruined line. Complete failure. Absolutely no reason to research it or to even go through this line, and that's the whole point of this game. To have players grind, upgrade and research their tanks out of joy and curiosity. This is how you loose the player base. There's no reason to grind when there's frustration waiting at the end.

wEight_Tanker #7 Posted 05 May 2019 - 02:58 PM

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View PostVela_ZG, on 05 May 2019 - 02:47 PM, said:

Don't get me wrong, I'm not whining about this thing being a disappointment. I just won't play it, no big deal. What I don't understand is how WG can make such a mistake. It's a ruined line. Complete failure. Absolutely no reason to research it or to even go through this line, and that's the whole point of this game. To have players grind, upgrade and research their tanks out of joy and curiosity. This is how you loose the player base. There's no reason to grind when there's frustration waiting at the end.

 

It's because of people without a proper tactic and no knowledge of using cover whining about getting shot by it. It was not the case all the time, of course, FV players don't always sit behind a cover and wait for you to pop up in front of them, but that right there is a greater force and I choose which painful tech tree to go up carefully because of crap like that. I am still grinding up the FV line, but the nerf doesn't affect me that much, it did in the beginning because it was just plain out of nowhere, but then I remembered the Conway for example which stats I like as well, as much as it wouldn't cost me anything to try the FV itself either.

1ncompetenc3 #8 Posted 05 May 2019 - 03:01 PM

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Why would you buy a tank right after it got nerfed?

Dorander #9 Posted 05 May 2019 - 03:03 PM

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View PostwEight_Tanker, on 05 May 2019 - 01:58 PM, said:

 

It's because of people without a proper tactic and no knowledge of using cover whining about getting shot by it. It was not the case all the time, of course, FV players don't always sit behind a cover and wait for you to pop up in front of them, but that right there is a greater force and I choose which painful tech tree to go up carefully because of crap like that. I am still grinding up the FV line, but the nerf doesn't affect me that much, it did in the beginning because it was just plain out of nowhere, but then I remembered the Conway for example which stats I like as well, as much as it wouldn't cost me anything to try the FV itself either.

 

"The FV is not a problem, just avoid getting shot" is not an argument. You can't realistically avoid being in front of an enemy's gun unless you redline camp all game and your team wins for you, or you drown yourself. Good on you for enjoying yourself and trying stuff though, that's a good attitude.

 

View PostVela_ZG, on 05 May 2019 - 01:47 PM, said:

Don't get me wrong, I'm not whining about this thing being a disappointment. I just won't play it, no big deal. What I don't understand is how WG can make such a mistake. It's a ruined line. Complete failure. Absolutely no reason to research it or to even go through this line, and that's the whole point of this game. To have players grind, upgrade and research their tanks out of joy and curiosity. This is how you loose the player base. There's no reason to grind when there's frustration waiting at the end.

 

I've just accepted the conclusion that there's somebody or multiple somebodies on the development team who think that "iconic" designs, which in practice frequently means horrible min/maxing, somehow make for good gameplay. What they are good for is trophies, the "Yay I got this thing" effect. Even Russian meds aren't as min-maxed as these things.

 

I fear that Wargaming seems to think that the counter to high armour is high damage output, specifically high alpha. In practice however tanks with high alpha favour targets on which they are guaranteed to inflict the most of that damage, doubly so in the case of a shell mechanic that seldomly penetrates well armoured targets. The damage rate from an FV on highly armoured targets is painful but not the worst problem in the world, it's problematic on lightly armoured targets.



Dava_117 #10 Posted 05 May 2019 - 03:22 PM

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To be fair, FV problem is the extreme alpha of both HE and HESH rounds.

1850/2=925 so if you fail to pen a paper target or you hit an heavily armoured tank close to lightly armoured parts like engine deck or under the hull, the damage output is close to an AP penetration. 

Let's take an example of a similar gameplay tank: the KV-2.

KV-2 AP round have 700 alpha while the HE round sports 910 alpha. A non penetrating HE shell will deal far less damage than a penetrating AP round (400-450 vs 700).

The same should have been done on both the deathstars.

Reducing HE and HESH round alpha to 1500 would already give to the user a valid choice between an high DPM AP round and a less reliable but potentially higher damage dealing HE(SH) round.

But guess WG makes a lot of money out of all the HESH spamming dethstars to do such a reasoning...


Edited by Dava_117, 05 May 2019 - 03:23 PM.


NekoPuffer_PPP #11 Posted 05 May 2019 - 03:25 PM

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View Postfriedeggnchips, on 05 May 2019 - 02:24 PM, said:

 

Mods please don't nuke this, it's the most appropriate meme for the occasion.

wEight_Tanker #12 Posted 05 May 2019 - 03:26 PM

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View PostDorander, on 05 May 2019 - 03:03 PM, said:

 

"The FV is not a problem, just avoid getting shot" is not an argument. You can't realistically avoid being in front of an enemy's gun unless you redline camp all game and your team wins for you, or you drown yourself. Good on you for enjoying yourself and trying stuff though, that's a good attitude.

 

Talking about accusations, I never said I was redline camping. Also I did point out that avoiding getting shot all the time isn't the case, I was just summing up the majority of people whining about the tank with no constructiveness while I do agree that a battleship gun is too strong. :^)



Dorander #13 Posted 05 May 2019 - 03:28 PM

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View PostwEight_Tanker, on 05 May 2019 - 02:26 PM, said:

 

Talking about accusations, I never said I was redline camping. Also I did point out that avoiding getting shot all the time isn't the case, I was just summing up the majority of people whining about the tank with no constructiveness while I do agree that a battleship gun is too strong. :^)

 

I wasn't, for the record, accusing you of doing that. I was merely stating that that is the only way to avoid ever being in front of an enemy's gun, so it runs contrary to the idea of using "good tactics" to avoid being sent back to the garage by an FV.

friedeggnchips #14 Posted 05 May 2019 - 03:31 PM

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View PostPervyPastryPuffer, on 05 May 2019 - 02:25 PM, said:

 

Mods please don't nuke this, it's the most appropriate meme for the occasion.

 

Ah how the mods love the big red button that launches the boomy things

Vela_ZG #15 Posted 05 May 2019 - 03:31 PM

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View Post1ncompetenc3, on 05 May 2019 - 03:01 PM, said:

Why would you buy a tank right after it got nerfed?

 

Because I thought it couldn't be that bad. I was curious what's it like to have such good alpha. And it sucks because it's HESH, so you really need to hit a spot where you can go through with 230mm of pen and be lucky not to hit spaced armor or tracks. Plus they nerfed the accuracy now aswell.

DA_ZOHAN #16 Posted 05 May 2019 - 03:45 PM

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Put Soviet Flag on it, it might trick the RNG system.

wEight_Tanker #17 Posted 05 May 2019 - 03:45 PM

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View PostDorander, on 05 May 2019 - 03:28 PM, said:

 

I wasn't, for the record, accusing you of doing that. I was merely stating that that is the only way to avoid ever being in front of an enemy's gun, so it runs contrary to the idea of using "good tactics" to avoid being sent back to the garage by an FV.

 

I wasn't talking about good tactics that a "pro" would pull off, but a proper tactic someone with a brain would use, which is to hide and not expose themselves intentionally, which can happen a lot, even to me. xD

BlackBloodBandit #18 Posted 05 May 2019 - 04:46 PM

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View PostwEight_Tanker, on 05 May 2019 - 02:58 PM, said:

It's because of people without a proper tactic and no knowledge of using cover whining about getting shot by it.

That's not true. One point is the fact that there are way too many high alpha guns in the game already and the biggest examples are on tier 10, so FV4005 not being an exception here. This tank clearly has broken pen mechanics and the fact that it can 1-shot tier 8 tanks is disgusting.

A lot of players come up with things like: you can flank it, or you pick a stupid position to attack it. There are enough situations where you don't have another option then to attack through open terrain or have no chance to win that battle. It doesn't matter in that case wether you fight a FV4005 or another td.



friedeggnchips #19 Posted 05 May 2019 - 04:51 PM

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View PostBlackBloodBandit, on 05 May 2019 - 03:46 PM, said:

That's not true. One point is the fact that there are way too many high alpha guns in the game already and the biggest examples are on tier 10, so FV4005 not being an exception here. This tank clearly has broken pen mechanics and the fact that it can 1-shot tier 8 tanks is disgusting.

A lot of players come up with things like: you can flank it, or you pick a stupid position to attack it. There are enough situations where you don't have another option then to attack through open terrain or have no chance to win that battle. It doesn't matter in that case wether you fight a FV4005 or another td.

 

--> Wargaming thinks adding a tank with 1750 alpha damage is a good idea

 

--> Everyone complains that they can't beat it

 

--> Wargaming adds a tank with ridiculous armour to combat the other tank

 

--> everyone starts using APCR to penetrate the tank because they can't do anything else

 

---> both tanks get nerfed to the ground and become giant HE magnets that can't defend nor attack anything.


Sound familiar?

 


Edited by friedeggnchips, 05 May 2019 - 04:52 PM.


hasnainrakha57 #20 Posted 05 May 2019 - 05:45 PM

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Yes those who loved fv4005 more than thier mom and dad will now say that fv is worst tank so just they can stop the incoming nerf and happily 1 shot every tank!




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