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KV-4 a dissapointment


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PhantomDiablo01 #1 Posted 06 May 2019 - 08:39 PM

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having slogged my way along the heavy Russian line im finding the KV-4 a total let down.. sluggish as hell ( understandable in a Russian heavy ) but worse than that is it feels it has no real firepower or armour.. anything I hit it just bounces off and anything that hits me pens. decided to go back a few tiers to the KV1 and branch up and along on the kv-85 and IS line instead. given up grinding up to the ST-I as feel that will just be another disappointment too.. anyone else found this with the KV-4 just being a rather rubbish tier 8 heavy

MeetriX #2 Posted 06 May 2019 - 08:48 PM

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Weird?

Statistically it is your best tank.

 

Edit: Well, maybe not, but it is not the worst.


Edited by MeetriX, 06 May 2019 - 08:51 PM.


depressed_jellyfish #3 Posted 06 May 2019 - 08:48 PM

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ST-1 is good.
IS-4 on the other hand...

MeNoobTank #4 Posted 06 May 2019 - 08:51 PM

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View Postdepressed_jellyfish, on 06 May 2019 - 08:48 PM, said:

ST-1 is good.
IS-4 on the other hand...

 

He is talking about KV-4.

 

@OP: first of all why you grind this line ? The IS-7 line is better for newbies. Grind that first + that you will have alot of modules for IS-4 line already researched. KV-4 is slow but has very good gun with top penetration, also armor is very good but you need to learn how to use it. Search on YT WOT sidescraping.



Jumping_Turtle #5 Posted 06 May 2019 - 08:53 PM

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Come in @urquan

Laatikkomafia #6 Posted 06 May 2019 - 09:15 PM

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What did you expect?

 

The armor was viable 4 years ago.

You have meh mobility.

You have laughable alpha damage.



Dava_117 #7 Posted 06 May 2019 - 09:24 PM

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Don't you dare to trashtalk about my beloved KV-4. 

The top gun sports top notch penetration parameters and can harm basically any target in game with 289pen APCR.

The armour is reliable, but requires you to actually angle and use it. If you expect to sit in the open and bounce stuff for free, you will get pen every shot. 

Put yourself in a good sidescrape position and no one can harm you. 

In the open, allways move with the hull angled. Never point it at the enemy, wriggle a lot to prevent enemy to aim at the less armoured parts and also move the turret for the same reason.

 

Long story short, KV-4 greatly reward players that know about armour mechanics while punishing potatoes that expect armour to work by itself. 

Don't be a potato! Angle up! ;)



Laatikkomafia #8 Posted 06 May 2019 - 09:35 PM

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View PostDava_117, on 06 May 2019 - 10:24 PM, said:

Don't you dare to trashtalk about my beloved KV-4. 

The top gun sports top notch penetration parameters and can harm basically any target in game with 289pen APCR.

The armour is reliable, but requires you to actually angle and use it. If you expect to sit in the open and bounce stuff for free, you will get pen every shot. 

Put yourself in a good sidescrape position and no one can harm you. 

In the open, allways move with the hull angled. Never point it at the enemy, wriggle a lot to prevent enemy to aim at the less armoured parts and also move the turret for the same reason.

 

Long story short, KV-4 greatly reward players that know about armour mechanics while punishing potatoes that expect armour to work by itself. 

Don't be a potato! Angle up! ;)

 

Yes, it gets nice APCR pen.

 

The armor is far from being reliable. It is quite the opposite. Here is the armor against Emil I's premium APCR.

 

 

Even if you get into a sidescraping position, your turret is still paper. Especially if you fire at the enemy. But in that case, you'll most likely end up with a bad trade due to the pathetic alpha. There are tier 8 heavies with 490, 440, 400 and 390 alpha. The green areas are 85% chances of being penned,

 

Meanwhile actual modern tier 8 heavies get more armor without even angling.

 

 



Bordhaw #9 Posted 06 May 2019 - 09:44 PM

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View PostPhantomDiablo01, on 06 May 2019 - 07:39 PM, said:

KV-4

 

I think I saw one in Frontline..... it died.

 

 



malowany #10 Posted 06 May 2019 - 09:54 PM

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View PostPhantomDiablo01, on 06 May 2019 - 08:39 PM, said:

 sluggish as hell ( understandable in a Russian heavy )

 

IS series says hello



Dava_117 #11 Posted 06 May 2019 - 10:08 PM

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View PostLaatikkomafia, on 06 May 2019 - 09:35 PM, said:

 

Yes, it gets nice APCR pen.

 

The armor is far from being reliable. It is quite the opposite. Here is the armor against Emil I's premium APCR.

 

 

Even if you get into a sidescraping position, your turret is still paper. Especially if you fire at the enemy. But in that case, you'll most likely end up with a bad trade due to the pathetic alpha. There are tier 8 heavies with 490, 440, 400 and 390 alpha. The green areas are 85% chances of being penned,

 

Meanwhile actual modern tier 8 heavies get more armor without even angling.

 

 

 

The KV-4 has mainly a defensive role. After all it was designed to stop a German offensive and it do it's role quite well in game. You use armour to keep gun aimed at you and punish tanks that bounced or get distracted. You need to attract attention to grant to your team more space of action. That means that there may be battle in wich you fire very few shell while tanking a lot of damage to delay the enemy push while your team is winning another important flank. 



PhantomDiablo01 #12 Posted 06 May 2019 - 10:14 PM

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View PostMeNoobTank, on 06 May 2019 - 08:51 PM, said:

 

He is talking about KV-4.

 

@OP: first of all why you grind this line ? The IS-7 line is better for newbies. Grind that first + that you will have alot of modules for IS-4 line already researched. KV-4 is slow but has very good gun with top penetration, also armor is very good but you need to learn how to use it. Search on YT WOT sidescraping.

 

who said I was a noobie.. ive been playing wot for 2-3 years now on and off.. have always played Brit and USA line but decided to try the Russian line.. I have the IS-M on another account ( hated it and wish I had gone IS-3 instead )  I have 3 tier X tanks on my Brit line but found the Russian KV line to be the least enjoyable line ive played hence backtracking on this account along the IS line.. . I guess if I compare it to the caenarvon which I have the brit tank feels and handles so much better .

 


Edited by PhantomDiablo01, 06 May 2019 - 10:21 PM.


UrQuan #13 Posted 06 May 2019 - 11:12 PM

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The KV-4 is a decent heavy imo. However, it really needs its topgun for performing. Lucky you can unlock & equip this on a stock KV-4 if you save up XP for it (44K XP). Without that gun it won't be a pleasant experience.

Topgun offers a decent rof & good standard pen (227mm). The prem round is also very good, as it's an APCR round with 289mm pen (bonus, it's also the cheapest prem round of all the KV-4 guns). The alpha is rather standard, 320 damage, so won't scare anyone.

 

Top engine makes the KV-4 less sluggish to drive & gives it decent acceleration (will never be a mobile speedtank, but the top engine gets it out slug territory)

Topturret (needs tracks to equip) gives a host of small bonuses that can hardly be ignored. It grants a small HP bonus, extra viewrange, removal of a weakspot, rof & gun handling bonus for the topgun & ammo increase. By themselves, the small bonuses aren't worth much, but all combined it makes the tank operate just that bit smoother.

 

KV-4 main strength lies in the easy to angle armor. Unangled, the tank won't hold much shots, but when driving at angles, weakspots get smaller & harder to hit & your armor values go up, making you a rather tough tank to face.

Main thing is to stay moving one way or another, even just wiggling & going back & forth can be enough. Stand still & enemies can quietly aim at your weaker armor parts. Your tracks & side armor will be your main shields to absorb damage, so drive at angles, drive zig-zag when enemies are around.

 

Edit (because Pansenmann highlighted an important thing below): Never go alone, this counts for most tanks with low mobility. When things go bad, these tanks can't relocate easy, so they got to endure whatever comes their way. KV-4 shines with support backing it up. So pay attention where your support / possible support hangs out. And then tease the enemy to shoot into your angled sides, so your support can put some good shots in when the reds expose themselves too much in an attempt to get you.

 

With the meta shift for superheavies, the KV-4 has some characteristics that makes it good against them. For a superheavy it is rather mobile, able to outmaneuver the others. It also carries a gun with a high pen premium round, allowing it to pen the other superheavies easier.

I still drive mine alot & the amount of folks that don't know how to handle a KV-4 is staggering these days. Grants me some fun moments tho.

As long as I stand, you shall not pass!

 

Note, if you are used to british tanks, the KV & IS-M line can feel very sluggish to play & due to their specialist nature can feel rather limited in their play. I would rather advice the IS-3 line for you then because this line lies much closer to the brits in mobility & versatility, being more allround heavy tanks.

KV line you grind if you enjoy the whole armor aspect of the game, as it has several great tanks for people who are into that (KV-4, ST-I & IS-4 all are well armored tanks, but each of them has their own characteristics in armor: KV-4 is the steel brick approach: unangled armor, so you got to do the angling to maximize it. ST-I is a hulldown heavy with decent hull armor, allowing it to perform a multitude of armored roles. IS-4 sports strong allround armor & can tank some considerable damage once you get familiar with its armor loadout. Does suffer from lack of ammo hold tho...


Edited by UrQuan, 07 May 2019 - 12:11 AM.


Pansenmann #14 Posted 07 May 2019 - 12:03 AM

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While I am not as good as UrQuan is -

I take an awful lot of shots into the front sprocket

or turret cupola when not paying attention -

the KV-4tress is still a capable vehicle if you got a team with you.
never, ever try to go to a flank alone in that tank, unless you are facing tier 6 tanks :)



wEight_Tanker #15 Posted 07 May 2019 - 12:35 AM

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Don't get me started on the IS-M...

Fr33nzyFighter #16 Posted 07 May 2019 - 01:22 AM

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View PostDava_117, on 06 May 2019 - 09:24 PM, said:

Don't you dare to trashtalk about my beloved KV-4. 

The top gun sports top notch penetration parameters and can harm basically any target in game with 289pen APCR.

The armour is reliable, but requires you to actually angle and use it. If you expect to sit in the open and bounce stuff for free, you will get pen every shot. 

Put yourself in a good sidescrape position and no one can harm you. 

In the open, allways move with the hull angled. Never point it at the enemy, wriggle a lot to prevent enemy to aim at the less armoured parts and also move the turret for the same reason.

 

Long story short, KV-4 greatly reward players that know about armour mechanics while punishing potatoes that expect armour to work by itself. 

Don't be a potato! Angle up! ;)

 

You are funny, you can angle your armor how much you want, that trash cupola on top of the tank will screw you over countless times, nice side armor, great for sidescraping, if your lower plate wont be a footbal field, ah and again, cant hide that cupola, nice turet side armor, but its not a maus, again, the cupola on top, now if you are top tier its a great tank, but it will never perform as good as the IS-3 when meeting higher tiered oponents, all in all, its a nice tank with the most stupid cupola i've ever met.
00:23 Added after 1 minute

View PostwEight_Tanker, on 07 May 2019 - 12:35 AM, said:

Don't get me started on the IS-M...

 

wut? IS-M is one of the best tanks i've ever played, never bounced so many T10's in my life, blocked 8k in a T10 game, strong tank.

XxKuzkina_MatxX #17 Posted 07 May 2019 - 01:43 AM

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View PostFr33nzyFighter, on 07 May 2019 - 04:22 AM, said:

You are funny, you can angle your armor how much you want, that trash cupola on top of the tank will screw you over countless times, nice side armor, great for sidescraping, if your lower plate wont be a football field, ah and again, cant hide that cupola, nice turret side armor, but its not a maus, again, the cupola on top, now if you are top tier its a great tank, but it will never perform as good as the IS-3 when meeting higher tiered opponents, all in all, its a nice tank with the most stupid cupola i've ever met.

 

Yet he blocks about 1.5k damage on average every battle for 2.4k battles, that's a full HP IS-3 on top of his KV-4!!!

 

Why doubt others without checking facts? ask him how he does that or ask him for replays, tips or even a platoon. It's the way to go, learn from others and share your knowledge with others if you can help. :)


Edited by XxKuzkina_MatxX, 07 May 2019 - 01:45 AM.


Fr33nzyFighter #18 Posted 07 May 2019 - 03:15 AM

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View PostXxKuzkina_MatxX, on 07 May 2019 - 01:43 AM, said:

 

Yet he blocks about 1.5k damage on average every battle for 2.4k battles, that's a full HP IS-3 on top of his KV-4!!!

 

Why doubt others without checking facts? ask him how he does that or ask him for replays, tips or even a platoon. It's the way to go, learn from others and share your knowledge with others if you can help. :)

 

Id be glad to, no dought i have much to learn, but from experience the "top" players dont waste their time with the ones willing to learn.

XxKuzkina_MatxX #19 Posted 07 May 2019 - 03:35 AM

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View PostFr33nzyFighter, on 07 May 2019 - 06:15 AM, said:

Id be glad to, no doubt i have much to learn, but from experience the "top" players don't waste their time with the ones willing to learn.

 

Nah, Dava is cool and a lot of the really good players are cool too. I remember to this day the guy that tried to teach me how to climb in Mines with the BC. Oh my god i was so dense with the controls and the timing and we spent 2-3 hours trying some very simple climbs. That guy was a complete stranger yet he took a lot of time and effort to teach me some nifty stuff.

 

They are rare but they do exist indeed! :)



Dava_117 #20 Posted 07 May 2019 - 07:05 AM

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View PostFr33nzyFighter, on 07 May 2019 - 03:15 AM, said:

 

Id be glad to, no dought i have much to learn, but from experience the "top" players dont waste their time with the ones willing to learn.

 

Well, I'm far from a top player, but I like the armour usage part and get quite good at it.

I'm usually on the Forumites ingame channel when I play. The password is play4fun and I like to platoon with other players, as soon as they're respectful to their platoon mate. :)

 

About the commander miniturret on KV-4, you are partially right. It is indeed big, but is also as armoured as the main turret itself. This means that, while frontally is quite easy to pen, the side armour of that actually works too.

The whole gameplay of the tank is based on angling and baiting shots, and that cupola is perfect for that.You should not abuse of this tactic, because the enemy will learn, but it can soak up some damage to allow you to shoot back.

Also you should not be showing your LFP while sidescraping. The side armour is strong enough to allow you some extreme angle (even up to 45°!) and still bounce while the central turret position helps in not showing too much of your frontal armour to the enemy too.






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