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Do NOT bother with any Japanese HT - WG completely ruined them


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salvager #1 Posted 06 May 2019 - 11:45 PM

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My advice, having enjoyed these tanks for quite a while, is don't waste your time grinding up what is now a completely pointless and frustrating line, thanks to the heavy handed use of the nerf bat.  At the upper tiers, this line is now outclassed by every other HT line in the game, and also by most of the TD and MT lines.  You'll get individuals pontificating about how the 14cm on the Type 5 is 'now competitive' with buffed handling.  It's lies, they clearly haven't tried it.  They are going off the stats.  The 14cm is a pea shooter, that cannot pen frontally any equal tier opponent, even if you aim for the weak point.  While you are trying to get that elusive weak point, you are getting spammed with gold ammo that goes through your hull like butter, even when angled.  I have wasted hours of my life grinding this line, with 3 skill crews, and at a stroke it's been made a complete waste of time.   Don't make the same mistake, just go for any other line other than this.  Shame really.



FloppyBiscuit #2 Posted 07 May 2019 - 12:25 AM

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Good them types were disgusting anyways with their bs derp guns made for brain dead bots

Alfa_Tau #3 Posted 07 May 2019 - 11:45 PM

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View Postsalvager, on 06 May 2019 - 11:45 PM, said:

My advice, having enjoyed these tanks for quite a while, is don't waste your time grinding up what is now a completely pointless and frustrating line, thanks to the heavy handed use of thYee nerf bat.  At the upper tiers, this line is now outclassed by every other HT line in the game, and also by most of the TD and MT lines.  You'll get individuals pontificating about how the 14cm on the Type 5 is 'now competitive' with buffed handling.  It's lies, they clearly haven't tried it.  They are going off the stats.  The 14cm is a pea shooter, that cannot pen frontally any equal tier opponent, even if you aim for the weak point.  While you are trying to get that elusive weak point, you are getting spammed with gold ammo that goes through your hull like butter, even when angled.  I have wasted hours of my life grinding this line, with 3 skill crews, and at a stroke it's been made a complete waste of time.   Don't make the same mistake, just go for any other line other than this.  Shame really.

YEP 

for some reason WG has found and applied different solutions to the same problem.

FV4005 = people complain about excessive damage. Solution: damage untouched BUT gun Handling and mobility nerfed to a point where any ARTA seems a rocket with smart bomb precision.

Type 5 = big damage BUT more importantly NO WEAK spot making almost impossble for Lower tier to fight. solution: Armor UNTOUCHED ammo nerfed!! 

:) .(

WHY???

Anyway thanks for your advice. 



Jean_Lannes #4 Posted 08 May 2019 - 04:33 PM

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View PostAlfa_Tau, on 07 May 2019 - 11:45 PM, said:

YEP 

for some reason WG has found and applied different solutions to the same problem.

FV4005 = people complain about excessive damage. Solution: damage untouched BUT gun Handling and mobility nerfed to a point where any ARTA seems a rocket with smart bomb precision.

Type 5 = big damage BUT more importantly NO WEAK spot making almost impossble for Lower tier to fight. solution: Armor UNTOUCHED ammo nerfed!! 

:) .(

WHY???

Anyway thanks for your advice. 

I agree that top Heavy Jap Branch is now pointless… and costful.

Moreover, Type 5 H deals much less damage than before (900 vs 1400 with HEAT). FYI, I even bounced on a Maus side with the 'DERP gun' and inflicted 2 hits for resp 19 and 29 damage on the same MAUS… A joke !

I wont play this branch anymore...


Edited by Jean_Lannes, 08 May 2019 - 04:37 PM.


Shad0wize #5 Posted 08 May 2019 - 05:32 PM

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So wait, you're basically complaining that your tanks are not overpowered anymore, the glove has changed hands and now you're unable to derp people in the face for ludicrous amounts of damage anymore, thus the line is now garbage.

Which is not the case, the line works just like before, but God forbid you learn where to actually shoot at the enemy tanks. The line works almost as good as before and it's still impossible for a lot of tanks to damage them frontally even with premium ammunition loaded since they lack frontal weakspots.

 

I presume you guys are those Type 5's that shot everybody for 300 damage or so where their armour is thickest whilst the enemy Type 5 shot everybody for 700+ damage because they aimed properly. Good riddance I say, to many noob friendly tanks in the game, too much power creep and too many players winning not because their knowledge of the game and its mechanics but more or less just dumb luck.



Nishi_Kinuyo #6 Posted 08 May 2019 - 07:51 PM

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TL;DR: Learn to use the 14cm properly.

Alfa_Tau #7 Posted 12 May 2019 - 01:24 PM

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View PostShad0wize, on 08 May 2019 - 05:32 PM, said:

So wait, you're basically complaining that your tanks are not overpowered anymore, the glove has changed hands and now you're unable to derp people in the face for ludicrous amounts of damage anymore, thus the line is now garbage.

Which is not the case, the line works just like before, but God forbid you learn where to actually shoot at the enemy tanks. The line works almost as good as before and it's still impossible for a lot of tanks to damage them frontally even with premium ammunition loaded since they lack frontal weakspots.

 

I presume you guys are those Type 5's that shot everybody for 300 damage or so where their armour is thickest whilst the enemy Type 5 shot everybody for 700+ damage because they aimed properly. Good riddance I say, to many noob friendly tanks in the game, too much power creep and too many players winning not because their knowledge of the game and its mechanics but more or less just dumb luck.

 

Dear Friend

to presume that those who are complaining are NOOBS it's not the right way to contribute to a discussion. 

I dont have the Type 5 but I have the type 4 cause I recently unlocked it. This tank has 3 guns. 

First one is stock and it's a regular 127 mm gun with AP, AP special and HE. The Pen is 230 / 258 / 64. One of the lowest pen at tier 9 , and the DPM is  1650 !! 

Second gun requires to unlock tracks (due to its weight) 22.700 XP + 64.500 XP. this is the HATED Derp gun. 75 mm pen with HE /192 mm pen with HESH.

Now as you can see the pen on the derp gun is GOOD if you shoot at medium but every time you face a same tier Heavy is pitiful. you will pen it only if he is looking in another way and you can go on his flank.

Before the nerf you were doing more or less 400 damage per shot now you do 200+-. This means that even you face a tank like the German Tier VIII VK100P you have good chance to lose!

to be competitive you need to unlock the last gun 139,7 mm with 259 / 290 / 70 mm of pen . 

Now I have a question for you: If  I want to play a HT with this kind of gun performance WHY to bother grinding the Japanese line? Isn't it better the Polish line? or even the UK S. conqueror? 

One of the plus of this game is to have the opportunity to chose among different game style. Now it seems to me the game has become less various.

What's the reason to have different nations and tanks if they have to behave in the same way? 

 

12:26 Added after 1 minute

View PostNishi_Kinuyo, on 08 May 2019 - 07:51 PM, said:

TL;DR: Learn to use the 14cm properly.

 

perhaps you can explain us how to pen a tank with 250 mm of armor with 192 mm HESH? 

Nishi_Kinuyo #8 Posted 12 May 2019 - 03:13 PM

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View PostAlfa_Tau, on 12 May 2019 - 01:24 PM, said:

perhaps you can explain us how to pen a tank with 250 mm of armor with 192 mm HESH? 

14cm has 257mm AP pen and 290mm gold pen.

If you got trouble penning with those values, then the problem isn't the gun.



Alfa_Tau #9 Posted 12 May 2019 - 06:09 PM

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View PostNishi_Kinuyo, on 12 May 2019 - 03:13 PM, said:

14cm has 257mm AP pen and 290mm gold pen.

If you got trouble penning with those values, then the problem isn't the gun.

If you read carefully my post I mentioned that.

However I thought we were talking about the derb gun.

I highlighted the text so perhaps it will be easier for you to read.

In my recent experience the Tier X gun now is the only valid option on this tank, And this was my point.

 

View PostAlfa_Tau, on 12 May 2019 - 01:24 PM, said:

 

Dear Friend

to presume that those who are complaining are NOOBS it's not the right way to contribute to a discussion. 

I dont have the Type 5 but I have the type 4 cause I recently unlocked it. This tank has 3 guns. 

First one is stock and it's a regular 127 mm gun with AP, AP special and HE. The Pen is 230 / 258 / 64. One of the lowest pen at tier 9 , and the DPM is  1650 !! 

Second gun requires to unlock tracks (due to its weight) 22.700 XP + 64.500 XP. this is the HATED Derp gun. 75 mm pen with HE /192 mm pen with HESH.

Now as you can see the pen on the derp gun is GOOD if you shoot at medium but every time you face a same tier Heavy is pitiful. you will pen it only if he is looking in another way and you can go on his flank.

Before the nerf you were doing more or less 400 damage per shot now you do 200+-. This means that even you face a tank like the German Tier VIII VK100P you have good chance to lose!

to be competitive you need to unlock the last gun 139,7 mm with 259 / 290 / 70 mm of pen

Now I have a question for you: If  I want to play a HT with this kind of gun performance WHY to bother grinding the Japanese line? Isn't it better the Polish line? or even the UK S. conqueror? 

One of the plus of this game is to have the opportunity to chose among different game style. Now it seems to me the game has become less various.

What's the reason to have different nations and tanks if they have to behave in the same way? 

 

 



Junenova #10 Posted 13 May 2019 - 02:31 PM

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All that was needed to be changed was the HESH rounds, to change its damage and make it pen better instead of doing more damage. But they opted to nerf the entire gun, which was what made the Jap heavies stand out from all the other superheavies. The gun is basically just a cloned O-Ho gun, which is dreadful at Tier 9. The O-Ho itself sucked hard at Tier 8, especially after nerf.

 

Regarding everything else, these tanks were really overdramaticized in all the "Tank OP pls nerf" posts. Especially the armor, it's armor is good, even amazing, so what? That's the whole point of this tank. It's not even unpennable as much as it's been posted about, most average pen guns at Tier 9 and 10 have about a 50% chance at penning this tank from the front when you actually bother to aim at it's weakspots such as the driver's hatch and the MG port. Tier 9+ TDs make short work of a the Types. And maybe Tier 7 and 8 just aren't supposed to pen a superheavy from the front, even with gold ammo - wouldn't that literally defeat the entire purpose of a superheavy if they could? All these posts crying for a nerf made it seem like this thing was the second coming of the Chrysler K, having no weak spots at all. Yet there are tanks at the same tier with better mobility and armor at the same tier (T9 german VK).

 

But here we are, with a line that's been overnerfed, Tier 8 being trash, Tier 9 being barely decent and Tier 10 being not worth grinding for. The only way the tank was OP is in its psychological terror on the battlefield because "big tonk scary".

 

EDIT: And in all honesty, Type 4/5 armor was already irrelevant when you weren't top tier, because the press 2 to win mentality negated most of its armor at Tier 9 and 10. Because why try to outflank or outplay a heavy tank if you can just load gold, am I right? Only way to be competetive with armor at high tiers is if its impenetrable by gold, e.g. sloped turrets or very well angled upper plate armor.

 

 

 


Edited by Junenova, 14 May 2019 - 04:56 PM.


Alfa_Tau #11 Posted 13 May 2019 - 06:19 PM

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View PostJunenova, on 13 May 2019 - 02:31 PM, said:

All that was needed to be changed was the HESH rounds, to change its damage and make it pen better instead of doing more damage. But they opted to nerf the entire gun, which was what made the Jap heavies stand out from all the other superheavies. The gun is basically just a cloned O-Ho gun, which is dreadful at Tier 9. The O-Ho itself sucked hard at Tier 8, especially after nerf.

 

Regarding everything else, these tanks were really overdramaticized in all the "Tank OP pls nerf" posts. Especially the armor, it's armor is good, even amazing, so what? That's the whole point of this tank. It's not even unpennable as much as it's been posted about, most average pen guns at Tier 9 and 10 have about a 50% chance at penning this tank from the front when you actually bother to aim at it's weakspots such as the driver's hatch and the MG port. Tier 9+ TDs make short work of a the Types. And maybe Tier 7 and 8 just aren't supposed to pen a superheavy from the front, even with gold ammo - wouldn't that literally defeat the entire purpose of a superheavy if they could? All these posts crying for a nerf made it seem like this thing was the second coming of the Chrysler K, having no weak spots at all.

 

But here we are, with a line that's been overnerfed, Tier 8 being trash, Tier 9 being barely decent and Tier 10 being not worth grinding for. The only way the tank was OP is in its psychological terror on the battlefield because "big tonk scary".

 

Totally agree with your post.

As I wrote, every line should add some particular flavor. something different. What's the point of playing Types now ? If I want a good gun for sniping and fast reloading then better playing th UK line. S.Conqueror is way more scary now.

Talking about Super Armored Tier VIII have you seen the new German Premium HT? 490 Damage and 250 mm of frontal turret armor? This is going to be a better Chrisler K. 

GG 






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