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121 And Chinese Buffs

Chinese tanks playstyle power creep 121 WZ-120 T-34-2 T-34-1 Ranked Battles Random Battles

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Poll: 121 (87 members have cast votes)

You have to complete 250 battle in order to participate this poll.

Should the 121 be buffed drastically?

  1. Yes (65 votes [74.71%])

    Percentage of vote: 74.71%

  2. No (22 votes [25.29%])

    Percentage of vote: 25.29%

Is the Chinese Med tank tech tree very underwhelming and poor?

  1. Yes (74 votes [85.06%])

    Percentage of vote: 85.06%

  2. No (13 votes [14.94%])

    Percentage of vote: 14.94%

Where should Wargaming BUFF the 121

  1. Gun Deprssion (15 votes [17.24%])

    Percentage of vote: 17.24%

  2. Armor (8 votes [9.20%])

    Percentage of vote: 9.20%

  3. Mobility (7 votes [8.05%])

    Percentage of vote: 8.05%

  4. Aiming time and gun handling (57 votes [65.52%])

    Percentage of vote: 65.52%

Vote Hide poll

Cobra6 #21 Posted 02 June 2019 - 03:17 PM

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The only good tank in the Chinese medium line is the T-34-1 as it has a great turret that can bounce T9 guns, low profile so you can hide in terrain features and a nice alpha (although the gun is a bit potato).

 

All the other tanks in the line are utter *edit,

 

Cobra 6


Edited by xP4_warrior, 08 June 2019 - 10:50 AM.
*This post has been edited by the moderation team due to inappropriate remarks.


sokolicc #22 Posted 02 June 2019 - 03:44 PM

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View Posthes_a_pirate, on 02 June 2019 - 08:59 AM, said:

Looking at the tank stats 121 seems fine to me.

 

The one real problem on the Chinese medium line is T-34-2 (which is one of the worse Tier 8 tanks currently available, if not the worst), and WZ-120 has a terribly harsh grind if you did not grind the HT line (could also use better gun handling and aimtime on all its guns IMHO, especially the top 100mm and the 122mm big gun).

I think the issue is not 121 itself, but the fact that *edit like Object 430U exist. Both tanks fulfill the role of a medium with a hard-hitting gun, but 430U has significant advantages that make it plain superior to 121.

Now I'd rather WG grow some spine and nerf the problem tanks to more acceptable levels regardless of community whining (especially RU community) than keep up with piling buffs upon buffs because every time new tanks come out, chances are many old ones will become *edit.
 

 

Stop crapping about Ru community, since it has same problems like us.

Russians aren't apes that are solving frustrations by having OP SOVIET (not Russian) tanks in game.

 

You grow some spine and stop blaming whole nation and whole server and 50% of global playerbase for decisions of a COMPANY THAT NEEDS TO MAKE MONEY. And funny fact, those decisions are not well received on any server, even RU. Read RU forums a bit.

 

Really, i am so tired of prejudices that apes like you have.

No arguments, just pointless *edit.


Edited by xP4_warrior, 08 June 2019 - 10:49 AM.
*This post has been edited by the moderation team due to inappropriate remarks.


Lanrefni #23 Posted 02 June 2019 - 04:46 PM

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View PostCobra6, on 02 June 2019 - 04:17 PM, said:

All the other tanks in the line are utter *edit,

Now that's just hurtful.

And untrue.



pihip #24 Posted 08 June 2019 - 09:14 AM

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View Postsokolicc, on 02 June 2019 - 03:44 PM, said:

Stop crapping about Ru community, since it has same problems like us.

Russians aren't apes that are solving frustrations by having OP SOVIET (not Russian) tanks in game.

 

You grow some spine and stop blaming whole nation and whole server and 50% of global playerbase for decisions of a COMPANY THAT NEEDS TO MAKE MONEY. And funny fact, those decisions are not well received on any server, even RU. Read RU forums a bit.

 

Really, i am so tired of prejudices that apes like you have.

No arguments, just pointless *edit.

 

Yeah ok, cool story mate. :trollface:

WG is the one who should grow a spine and not back away like they did with Object 430 and 430U nerfs, those were pulled mere DAYS after they were announced for testing. I wonder why... :harp:

 

Post reported btw, have a nice day.


 



Stevies_Team #25 Posted 08 June 2019 - 09:47 AM

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Chinese tanks are proper communist tanks

Russian tanks are the tanks the communists would like to have had



ValkyrionX #26 Posted 08 June 2019 - 09:50 AM

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121 need only

 

  1. better gun handling
  2. more mobility 
  3. +30mm of frontal turret armor

 

and the buff is done 



XxKuzkina_MatxX #27 Posted 08 June 2019 - 11:41 AM

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View Posthes_a_pirate, on 08 June 2019 - 12:14 PM, said:

WG is the one who should grow a spine and not back away like they did with Object 430 and 430U nerfs, those were pulled mere DAYS after they were announced for testing. I wonder why...

 

If you didn't notice the whole package of changes was cancelled for all the 5 tanks. The Leo1 and STB-1 received different and more potent buffs even during the public test iterations and the AMX 30B, the 430 and the 430U changes were postponed. Why did that happen or what WG plan was are just speculations.

 

You should take his advice and take a look at the RU forums, same ideas on a larger scale.



pihip #28 Posted 08 June 2019 - 12:04 PM

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View PostXxKuzkina_MatxX, on 08 June 2019 - 11:41 AM, said:

If you didn't notice the whole package of changes was cancelled for all the 5 tanks. The Leo1 and STB-1 received different and more potent buffs even during the public test iterations and the AMX 30B, the 430 and the 430U changes were postponed. Why did that happen or what WG plan was are just speculations.

 

You should take his advice and take a look at the RU forums, same ideas on a larger scale.

 

I'm aware things changed and only the Leo and STB-1 got through in the end, but it's a fact that, back when all tanks were considered for changes, WG quickly pulled Object 430 and 430U from testing, which to be diplomatic was fairly suspicious.

Gkirmathal #29 Posted 08 June 2019 - 12:06 PM

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View PostCobra6, on 02 June 2019 - 02:17 PM, said:

The only good tank in the Chinese medium line is the T-34-1 as it has a great turret that can bounce T9 guns, low profile so you can hide in terrain features and a nice alpha (although the gun is potato).

 

Here, fixed it for ya :teethhappy:

 

But compared to others in it's tier, it's still a fight against it's 'gun depression- & aim time-exposure' most of the time IMO, due to the combination of the worst aim time of all non Chinese 100mm's on it's tier.

The Leo and T20 (even though it has the lowest dpm of tier 7), are much more comfortable and do not require a very good crew to feel comforable. While the 34-1 even with BIA and all the dispersion skills just is hit and a lot of miss.

(edit: trying to get my 2nd MOE and by gawd how many fully aimed shots fall on near the edge of the 60% of shots that should fall nearer the centre. Really infuriating)

 

In the Chinese med line it is indeed the best one tbh, which says a lot.


Edited by Gkirmathal, 08 June 2019 - 02:39 PM.


XxKuzkina_MatxX #30 Posted 08 June 2019 - 12:32 PM

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View Posthes_a_pirate, on 08 June 2019 - 03:04 PM, said:

I'm aware things changed and only the Leo and STB-1 got through in the end, but it's a fact that, back when all tanks were considered for changes, WG quickly pulled Object 430 and 430U from testing, which to be diplomatic was fairly suspicious.

 

But it's also a fact that WG themselves introduced the 430U and the 268V4 in the same patch of their own volition. No one over there asked for these particular tanks, dictated to WG how good they should be or prevented them from buffing the Chinese mediums or any other nation.

 

Tell you something funny, i played 53k battles here + about 5k of TBs, skirmishes, etc. and i also played around 60k battles in RU + about 10k in other modes. Never cared what nation i am playing or how does the tank looks (camo, style, model, etc.). When WG introduced the Patriot and the T26E5 i was genuinely confused! :)



ExistanceUK #31 Posted 08 June 2019 - 12:50 PM

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I think for me I'd go in a different way all together, I'd remove the T-34-2 then drop both the WZ120 and 121 down a tier then put the 113 as the tier 10.

Now this would necessitate a load of stat changes and a possible reclassification of the 113 to medium, then the 113 could get a few adjustments to make that tank a bit more relevant at the same time.

Or does that sound too radical? It just seems to me that the 121 isn't the only tank to have little relevance with the 430u in the game, the 113 isn't in the best place either.



Shacou #32 Posted 08 June 2019 - 03:56 PM

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121 is pointless with that trash gunhandling. Leopard 1 has just 20 alpha less and good handling now. Yes, Leopard 1 has no armor, but 121 armor isnt good either. When it comes to mobility, Leo is mobile and accelerates quickly. 121 is less agile than its tier 9 predecessor WZ-120.

121 needs serious changes.

MR_FIAT #33 Posted 08 June 2019 - 05:20 PM

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WZ-120 has one of the most brutal stock grinds in the game, i'd say that needs looking at first. That and the T-34-2 is a weaker Type 59 with full MM so that needs to be looked at aswell.

Lanrefni #34 Posted 08 June 2019 - 07:39 PM

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View PostShacou, on 08 June 2019 - 04:56 PM, said:

121 needs serious changes.

Actually...
No.



gitgud_cannot #35 Posted 09 June 2019 - 10:20 AM

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just buff the turret front a little and thats good enough for me, it has like tier 9 med turret, that can be penetrated with tier 10 AP most of the time, ffs T-54 has better turret than 121.

pihip #36 Posted 09 June 2019 - 10:42 AM

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View PostXxKuzkina_MatxX, on 08 June 2019 - 12:32 PM, said:

But it's also a fact that WG themselves introduced the 430U and the 268V4 in the same patch of their own volition. No one over there asked for these particular tanks, dictated to WG how good they should be or prevented them from buffing the Chinese mediums or any other nation.

 

Tell you something funny, i played 53k battles here + about 5k of TBs, skirmishes, etc. and i also played around 60k battles in RU + about 10k in other modes. Never cared what nation i am playing or how does the tank looks (camo, style, model, etc.). When WG introduced the Patriot and the T26E5 i was genuinely confused! :)

 

I just wish for WG to have a proper look at forgotten tanks like the Chinese mediums. Statistics might say they are fine in terms of damage and winrate, but when you compare the stat card of WZ-120 to that of T-54, how do you justify the huge disparity (in favor of T-54)?

I mean, they made Type 59 and T-34-3 quite good, yet barely anything has been done for the techtree tanks in how long exactly? (putting aside the buff to gun depression for 113 and 121, and the old, old nerf to HEAT penetration, when it went down to 250)

EDIT: Well, I just did a comparison between 121 and Object 430U, and the one big advantage Object has is the armor (which is absolutely ridiculous, we have HTs with less armor). I actually expected for Object to dominate over 121 the same way T-54 walks over WZ-120.


Edited by hes_a_pirate, 09 June 2019 - 10:47 AM.


Lanrefni #37 Posted 09 June 2019 - 11:39 AM

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View Posthes_a_pirate, on 09 June 2019 - 11:42 AM, said:

 

I just wish for WG to have a proper look at forgotten tanks like the Chinese mediums. Statistics might say they are fine in terms of damage and winrate, but when you compare the stat card of WZ-120 to that of T-54, how do you justify the huge disparity (in favor of T-54)?

I mean, they made Type 59 and T-34-3 quite good, yet barely anything has been done for the techtree tanks in how long exactly? (putting aside the buff to gun depression for 113 and 121, and the old, old nerf to HEAT penetration, when it went down to 250)

EDIT: Well, I just did a comparison between 121 and Object 430U, and the one big advantage Object has is the armor (which is absolutely ridiculous, we have HTs with less armor). I actually expected for Object to dominate over 121 the same way T-54 walks over WZ-120.

 

nobody cares about WZ-120.

BobjectMT never happens to dominate 121 in my hands.



XxKuzkina_MatxX #38 Posted 09 June 2019 - 12:10 PM

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View Posthes_a_pirate, on 09 June 2019 - 01:42 PM, said:

I just wish for WG to have a proper look at forgotten tanks like the Chinese mediums. Statistics might say they are fine in terms of damage and winrate, but when you compare the stat card of WZ-120 to that of T-54, how do you justify the huge disparity (in favor of T-54)?

I mean, they made Type 59 and T-34-3 quite good, yet barely anything has been done for the techtree tanks in how long exactly? (putting aside the buff to gun depression for 113 and 121, and the old, old nerf to HEAT penetration, when it went down to 250)

EDIT: Well, I just did a comparison between 121 and Object 430U, and the one big advantage Object has is the armor (which is absolutely ridiculous, we have HTs with less armor). I actually expected for Object to dominate over 121 the same way T-54 walks over WZ-120.

 

Something to do with Kongzhong or the Chinese server maybe?

 

I am not sure about comparing the WZ-120 to the T-54 is ideal, comparing it to the 430 is a better approach. Regardless, the WZ sure needs better turret dispersion and maybe a gun depression buff in my opinion.

 

Replacing the 121 with the 113, as ExistanceUK suggested above, with some modifications could work beautifully. The 113 is an excellent platform if tweaked properly to fit the medium line. I mean what's the 113 doing there after the 1-4?


Edited by XxKuzkina_MatxX, 09 June 2019 - 02:56 PM.


demon_tank #39 Posted 09 June 2019 - 12:25 PM

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121 needs a 430U alpha dmg nerff to 400.

 

Then a 1 degree gun depression buff.



Lanrefni #40 Posted 09 June 2019 - 12:40 PM

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Block Quote

View PostXxKuzkina_MatxX, on 09 June 2019 - 01:10 PM, said:

 

Replacing the 121 with the 113, 

 

No, you won't.

View Postdemon_tank, on 09 June 2019 - 01:25 PM, said:

121 needs a 430U alpha dmg nerff to 400.

 

Then a 1 degree gun depression buff.

why of course, let's make the one unique stat of the tank similar to others, so it doesn't stay unique anymore.






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