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Special ammunation rebalancing

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Kartoshkaya #21 Posted 02 June 2019 - 06:10 PM

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View Postsaxsan4, on 02 June 2019 - 06:08 PM, said:

 

Do you even play the game, what benefit is there of using AP over APCR in a excelsior???

 

Did you ever fired HEAT (wich is the most used premium ammo at tier X and not APCR) to tracks ?

saxsan4 #22 Posted 02 June 2019 - 06:10 PM

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View PostKartoshkaya, on 02 June 2019 - 05:10 PM, said:

 

Did you ever fired HEAT (wich is the most used premium ammo at tier X and not APCR) to tracks ?

 

I am not talking about HEAT, most tanks have APCR at premium and most people don't play tier 10 in randoms

KanonenVogel19 #23 Posted 02 June 2019 - 06:10 PM

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View Postsaxsan4, on 02 June 2019 - 06:08 PM, said:

Do you even play the game, what benefit is there of using AP over APCR in a excelsior???

 

First of all, you get better normalization. That alone is good enough reason to pick AP unless the player is too lazy to switch ammo types during battle.

 

Secondly, do we currently have overpenetration in the game? So why use the current game as an example against implementing more realistic shell mechanics? Do you actually read what's being said back to you or are you trying to maximize your posts per minute?



saxsan4 #24 Posted 02 June 2019 - 06:12 PM

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View PostKanonenVogel19, on 02 June 2019 - 05:10 PM, said:

 

First of all, you get better normalization. That alone is good enough reason to pick AP unless the player is too lazy to switch ammo types during battle.

 

Secondly, do we currently have overpenetration in the game? So why use the current game as an example against implementing more realistic shell mechanics? Do you actually read what's being said back to you or are you trying to maximize your posts per minute?

 

Which has very little effect in tier 5, all you will do is make armour less effective . Gold ammo is not even a big problem at the moment, just limit the amount of shells that can be gold ammo to 50% and problem is  fixed

Kartoshkaya #25 Posted 02 June 2019 - 06:14 PM

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View Postsaxsan4, on 02 June 2019 - 06:10 PM, said:

 

I am not talking about HEAT, most tanks have APCR at premium and most people don't play tier 10 in randoms

 

The super heavy without weakspot are not in tier V you know ? 

KanonenVogel19 #26 Posted 02 June 2019 - 06:16 PM

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View Postsaxsan4, on 02 June 2019 - 06:12 PM, said:

all you will do is make armour less effective

 

You have to be joking. Yes, it will make armor less effective, isn't that the whole reason why you fire premium ammo in the first place?

 

View Postsaxsan4, on 02 June 2019 - 06:12 PM, said:

Gold ammo is not even a big problem at the moment

 

Premium ammo is a huge problem in this game. If you don't understand that, I don't think there's any point in us discussing this further.

 

View Postsaxsan4, on 02 June 2019 - 06:12 PM, said:

limit the amount of shells that can be gold ammo to 50% and problem is  fixed

 

That's called reducing the problem, not fixing the problem.



saxsan4 #27 Posted 02 June 2019 - 06:22 PM

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View PostKanonenVogel19, on 02 June 2019 - 05:16 PM, said:

 

You have to be joking. Yes, it will make armor less effective, isn't that the whole reason why you fire premium ammo in the first place?

 

 

Premium ammo is a huge problem in this game. If you don't understand that, I don't think there's any point in us discussing this further.

 

 

That's called reducing the problem, not fixing the problem.

 

Armour is already not effective enough,  why would you wish to make it worse!!!!


 

I don't think you play the game



Laur_Balaur_XD #28 Posted 02 June 2019 - 06:24 PM

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View Postsaxsan4, on 02 June 2019 - 05:10 PM, said:

 

I am not talking about HEAT, most tanks have APCR at premium and most people don't play tier 10 in randoms

 

Really? At least at high tier most tanks have HEAT, not APCR. From tier 10 tanks just IS7, E3, E4, SConq, FochB and 50B have APCR as premium ammo.

And at lower tiers there are not so many tanks that have impenetrable armor

17:25 Added after 0 minutes

View Postsaxsan4, on 02 June 2019 - 05:22 PM, said:

 

Armour is already not effective enough,  why would you wish to make it worse!!!!

 

 

:D



Kartoshkaya #29 Posted 02 June 2019 - 06:27 PM

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Armour is already not effective enough,  why would you wish to make it worse!!!!, Saxsan4, 2019

 

Quote of the year ?



KanonenVogel19 #30 Posted 02 June 2019 - 06:28 PM

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View Postsaxsan4, on 02 June 2019 - 06:22 PM, said:

Armour is already not effective enough,  why would you wish to make it worse!!!!

 

Ok, so you don't think that armour is effective enough, but you still want to keep high penetration rounds?

 

And apart from that, it seems you don't really understand the difference between having high penetration rounds and making them cost the same. Regardless if you think that armor is effective or not, revising the cost of ammo is a completely separate problem. Regardless if people want to keep high penetration rounds or not, we should all agree that having shells that are so much more expensive are not healthy for the game. If high penetration rounds are needed to play the game, why should they be so expensive so that not all players feel that they can use them?



saxsan4 #31 Posted 02 June 2019 - 06:28 PM

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View PostKartoshkaya, on 02 June 2019 - 05:27 PM, said:

Armour is already not effective enough,  why would you wish to make it worse!!!!, Saxsan4, 2019

 

Quote of the year ?

 

all heavies

get penned frontally

very easily

17:29 Added after 0 minutes

View PostKanonenVogel19, on 02 June 2019 - 05:28 PM, said:

 

Ok, so you don't think that armour is effective enough, but you still want to keep high penetration rounds?

 

And apart from that, it seems you don't really understand the difference between having high penetration rounds and making them cost the same. Regardless if you think that armor is effective or not, revising the cost of ammo is a completely separate problem. Regardless if people want to keep high penetration rounds or not, we should all agree that having shells that are so much more expensive are not healthy for the game. If high penetration rounds are needed to play the game, why should they be so expensive so that not all players feel that they can use them?

 

high penetration rounds balance themselves out because they are expensive.

imagine pz 2 j with profit every game, low tiers will be full of them



Kartoshkaya #32 Posted 02 June 2019 - 06:35 PM

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View Postsaxsan4, on 02 June 2019 - 06:28 PM, said:

 

all heavies

get penned frontally

very easily

 

Maus vs Maus standard ammo :

 

 

Maus vs Maus special ammo:

 

 

Do you even play this game ?



KanonenVogel19 #33 Posted 02 June 2019 - 06:36 PM

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View Postsaxsan4, on 02 June 2019 - 06:28 PM, said:

high penetration rounds balance themselves out because they are expensive.

 

You don't get this, do you?

 

You can't balance a battle with credits. How difficult is it to understand that?

 

Because players can get credits outside of the battle, or even through their wallet, which means that a player can basically have infinite amounts of credits in a single instance of a battle. You can't balance that. I can't explain this more clear.

 

High penetration rounds should be balanced with other downsides. Not neccesarily damage, but other things. As I said, APCR rounds run the risk of overpenetration if you shoot them at too lightly armored targets. HEAT does not even have the rediculous amounts of penetration that they have in the game. They gain their advantage thanks to not losing penetration over distance. Shells are balanced in real life thanks to physics.

 

Again, using credits as a balancing factor doesn't work. The current state of ranked battles should be enough proof of that.



saxsan4 #34 Posted 02 June 2019 - 06:37 PM

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View PostKartoshkaya, on 02 June 2019 - 05:35 PM, said:

 

Maus vs Maus standard ammo :

 

 

Maus vs Maus special ammo:

 

 

Do you even play this game ?

 

You picked the one heavy its hard to pen LOOOL. And if both Mauses can't pen easily frontally then it encourages tactics. Yes i know its not common for you but you should learn to you know, flank. That is the whole point of having good armour so you have to be flanked.
17:37 Added after 0 minutes

View PostKanonenVogel19, on 02 June 2019 - 05:36 PM, said:

 

You don't get this, do you?

 

You can't balance a battle with credits. How difficult is it to understand that?

 

Because players can get credits outside of the battle, or even through their wallet, which means that a player can basically have infinite amounts of credits in a single instance of a battle. You can't balance that. I can't explain this more clear.

 

High penetration rounds should be balanced with other downsides. Not neccesarily damage, but other things. As I said, APCR rounds run the risk of overpenetration if you shoot them at too lightly armored targets. HEAT does not even have the rediculous amounts of penetration that they have in the game. They gain their advantage thanks to not losing penetration over distance. Shells are balanced in real life thanks to physics.

 

Again, using credits as a balancing factor doesn't work. The current state of ranked battles should be enough proof of that.

 

None of those thing's are in the game

Kartoshkaya #35 Posted 02 June 2019 - 06:40 PM

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View Postsaxsan4, on 02 June 2019 - 06:37 PM, said:

 

You picked the one heavy its hard to pen LOOOL.

 

Hull down sconq :

 

 

Side scraping 705A :

 

 

Do you even play this game ?


Edited by Kartoshkaya, 02 June 2019 - 06:43 PM.


KanonenVogel19 #36 Posted 02 June 2019 - 06:42 PM

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View Postsaxsan4, on 02 June 2019 - 06:37 PM, said:

None of those thing's are in the game

 

Do you have the capability to write more than half a sentence or are you as I said before just trying to maximize your posts per minute?

 

Does it matter that we don't have those things in the game right now? No, because there's a premium ammo rework incoming. Maybe you should read the news if you still havn't heard of it. I get the feeling that you're not really after a serius discussion here.



saxsan4 #37 Posted 02 June 2019 - 06:44 PM

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View PostKartoshkaya, on 02 June 2019 - 05:40 PM, said:

 

Hull down sconq :

 

 

Side scraping 705A :

 

 

Do you even play this game ?

 

so the only way to prove the point is to not even use the frontal armour, you have picked very specific positions and now say LOOK. I have won this debate
17:45 Added after 1 minute

View PostKanonenVogel19, on 02 June 2019 - 05:42 PM, said:

 

Do you have the capability to write more than half a sentence or are you as I said before just trying to maximize your posts per minute?

 

Does it matter that we don't have those things in the game right now? No, because there's a premium ammo rework incoming. Maybe you should read the news if you still havn't heard of it. I get the feeling that you're not really after a serius discussion here.

 

I have been on this forum for YEARS. Never have I encountered such rudeness. I am simply saying what your asking for would completely destroy how the game has been set up. Every single tank would need to be reworked

Kartoshkaya #38 Posted 02 June 2019 - 06:46 PM

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View Postsaxsan4, on 02 June 2019 - 06:44 PM, said:

 

so the only way to prove the point is to not even use the frontal armour, you have picked very specific positions and now say LOOK. I have won this debate

 

If you drive one of these tanks and don't use these position, you're trash at this game.

 

Oh and btw with gold ammo weakspots appears on the 705A :

 



saxsan4 #39 Posted 02 June 2019 - 06:47 PM

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View PostKartoshkaya, on 02 June 2019 - 05:46 PM, said:

 

If you drive one of these tanks and don't use these position, you're trash at this game.

 

Oh and btw with gold ammo weakspots appears on the 705A :

 

 

No, because you cant do that on most maps at all of the time. They are meant to be good when using their strengths. If they are there then you GO FLANK

Kartoshkaya #40 Posted 02 June 2019 - 06:48 PM

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View Postsaxsan4, on 02 June 2019 - 06:47 PM, said:

 

No, because you cant do that on most maps at all of the time. They are meant to be good when using their strengths. If they are there then you GO FLANK

 

But you said it was easy to pen all heavies frontaly ? Now you talk about flanking and penning them when they're not using their strenght ?

Edited by Kartoshkaya, 02 June 2019 - 06:48 PM.






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