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Poll: Disabling Friendly Fire / Team Damage

friendly fire team damage

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Poll: Disabling Friendly Fire / Team Damage (131 members have cast votes)

You have to complete 250 battles in order to participate this poll.

Impressions on the proposed changes to friendly fire / team damage

  1. Very Good (35 votes [26.72%])

    Percentage of vote: 26.72%

  2. Good (13 votes [9.92%])

    Percentage of vote: 9.92%

  3. Indifferent (14 votes [10.69%])

    Percentage of vote: 10.69%

  4. Bad (19 votes [14.50%])

    Percentage of vote: 14.50%

  5. Very Bad (50 votes [38.17%])

    Percentage of vote: 38.17%

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Gruff_ #1 Posted 10 July 2019 - 04:59 PM

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Discusion of topic exists here http://forum.worldoftanks.eu/index.php?/topic/712885-team-damage-disabled/

 


Edited by Gruff_, 10 July 2019 - 08:42 PM.


Gruff_ #2 Posted 10 July 2019 - 09:38 PM

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Shameless bump for more votes as 59 views but only 19 votes, dont' be shy.

Edited by Gruff_, 10 July 2019 - 09:39 PM.


onderschepper #3 Posted 10 July 2019 - 10:18 PM

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Soooo Mario Kart 8 has friendly fire, but players of a mature game can not function maturely with the mechanic.

 

8 year olds for the win, apparently! :D



spamhamstar #4 Posted 10 July 2019 - 10:33 PM

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View Postonderschepper, on 10 July 2019 - 09:18 PM, said:

Soooo Mario Kart 8 has friendly fire, but players of a mature game can not function maturely with the mechanic.

 

8 year olds for the win, apparently! :D

 

Exactly this.

 

If players are abusing a game mechanic does that mean the mechanic itself is broken?  Should that mechanic be removed or should it be those that are abusing it that are removed? 

 

I say keep team damage & just introduce harsher penalties.  The only problem with that is that a lot of those actually getting punished often aren't the ones that are actually abusing the mechanic, but just retaliating against those that are.  I suppose they'd soon learn :D



PanzerVor87 #5 Posted 11 July 2019 - 07:27 AM

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I'm fine with this going live, if people have issues with it and think friendly fire is a good mechanic there's a fundamental problem with the playerbase imho.

This would prevent scenarios such as getting teamkilled for trying to capture a base, [edited] firing at each other for fun (what "fun" only they know) or as retaliation for some perceived slight of unknown seriousness, and it would force griefers to be a bit more creative when they want arty to die because it's arty.


And yes I fully expect many of these fine gentlement to try and shoot allies anyway when this goes live, because they most likely won't get the memo anyway. ;)



Yakito #6 Posted 11 July 2019 - 09:23 AM

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View Postspamhamstar, on 10 July 2019 - 09:33 PM, said:

 

 problem with that is that a lot of those actually getting punished often aren't the ones that are actually abusing the mechanic, but just retaliating against those that are. 

You literally just proved that team damage needs to be disabled and there's nothing good about it at all. 



onderschepper #7 Posted 11 July 2019 - 11:29 AM

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View Postonderschepper, on 10 July 2019 - 08:01 PM, said:

Mario Kart 8 has Friendly Fire..............so 8 year olds can be responsible and not shoot their allies but players 18+ can not without intervention. :facepalm::D

View Posteekeeboo, on 10 July 2019 - 11:03 PM, said:

Fortunately Mario kart has people not wantinting to team damage actively :(

(http://forum.worldof...random-battles/)

 

Eek has a point with that reply, the mindset of a certain demographic has necessitated this change. ¯\_(ツ)_/¯



spamhamstar #8 Posted 11 July 2019 - 12:03 PM

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View PostYakito, on 11 July 2019 - 08:23 AM, said:

You literally just proved that team damage needs to be disabled and there's nothing good about it at all. 

 

No, but you just proved that you don't need much "proof" to convince you of something. 

 

If you are shooting a team mate you are breaking the rules whatever the reason for that is & so should get punished for it.  There is absolutely nothing wrong with the mechanic.  It's the players deliberately shooting each other that are the problem.

 

This is why we lost cross team chat & now we're losing team damage & potentially in game stats.  There's no problem with players using the vast majority of mods, so should they all be banned because some players abuse them?  Should they remove the ability to play low tiers once you reach a certain number of battles to prevent seal clubbing?  Perhaps they need to remove the physics to prevent players flipping other tanks?  How much more are they going to remove from the game before they realise what the actual problem is?

 

<a href='https://encrypted-tbn0.gstatic.com/images?q=tbn:ANd9GcTc5uWxsePcCnt_NUd1oPNn4OfOBh5R5GC9SC_ZQx_28ZHB0uv1gQ' class='bbc_url' title='External link' rel='external'>https://encrypted-tb...ZQx_28ZHB0uv1gQ</a>

 

Disclaimer: this is all my personal opinion & so not proof of anything!



Simeon85 #9 Posted 11 July 2019 - 12:07 PM

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I think its a good change and have yet to see a good argument against this, people against this seem to happy people getting punished for others mistakes/anger, whereas this change protects the people it should be protecting, which is the thousands of players who get team damaged through no fault of their own.

 

I agree with the guy above, the people against this says something bad about the playerbase IMO like they feel they should have the right to dish out their own punishments. 

 

-------------------------------

 

View Postspamhamstar, on 11 July 2019 - 09:03 PM, said:

If you are shooting a team mate you are breaking the rules whatever the reason for that is & so should get punished for it.  There is absolutely nothing wrong with the mechanic.  It's the players deliberately shooting each other that are the problem.

 

That is the same argument that the gun lobbyists use to defend guns and its fundamentally a bad one.

 

Especially as there is no positive side to team damage anyway, it doesn't add anything to the game. 

 

There is everything wrong with the mechanic because it allows people who have done nothing wrong to have their games ruined by other player's carelessness or anger. For which the punishment are pretty irrelevant because prevention is always going to be better for the victim than punishment is. 

 

 

 

 

 


Edited by Simeon85, 11 July 2019 - 12:10 PM.


jeffrey_mk2 #10 Posted 11 July 2019 - 01:06 PM

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View PostSimeon85, on 11 July 2019 - 11:07 AM, said:

I think its a good change and have yet to see a good argument against this, people against this seem to happy people getting punished for others mistakes/anger, whereas this change protects the people it should be protecting, which is the thousands of players who get team damaged through no fault of their own.

 

I agree with the guy above, the people against this says something bad about the playerbase IMO like they feel they should have the right to dish out their own punishments. 

 

-------------------------------

 

 

That is the same argument that the gun lobbyists use to defend guns and its fundamentally a bad one.

 

Especially as there is no positive side to team damage anyway, it doesn't add anything to the game. 

 

There is everything wrong with the mechanic because it allows people who have done nothing wrong to have their games ruined by other player's carelessness or anger. For which the punishment are pretty irrelevant because prevention is always going to be better for the victim than punishment is. 

 

 

 

 

 

The difference is that this is a game and by removing team damage you also remove a lot of funny situations. Like you shooting with a derp tank and then in the distance far away you suddenly see an ally run into it .....I mean those things are quite funny.

I guess the guy that got hit found it less funny but this chance is the same for everybody.

If you remove team damage other people can just drive in front of you without the chance getting hit by you, so what will happen if you just empty your clip ??? People drive in front and you did nothing.

Now you need some tactics and thinking work to watch out when to shoot , when to drive in front of other their guns etc.

It only creates other problems like people trolling you the whole game without any problems like pushing /blocking you and you also remove a small part of fun in my opinion. 

Rather change the punishment for team dmg then remove team dmg.

You could even make some kind of missions that will learn how to play the game properly.


Edited by jeffrey_mk2, 11 July 2019 - 01:07 PM.


Balc0ra #11 Posted 11 July 2019 - 01:25 PM

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I'm on the fence about it after seeing how it worked on console. Might do wonders. Might zero difference. FL it's working fine, because most arguments are 2 km away. Or because everyone is in the same grid, so there is enough chaos as is to notice where most are etc. 

 

In randoms, you rub anyone the wrong way, take their spot or even bump them out of spawn. They will shoot you. Now they can't. And I'll bet there will be some blocking, pushing etc instead. But... unlike console they did keep some aspects that can turn you blue on still. They did not turn everything off. So some actions will still have consequences. That might help. Like pushing a friendly into the water or off a cliff causing self destruct.

 

One thing I was skeptical about was the fact arty would keep its friendly stun. But apparently they will still turn blue with it. So let's see how that goes. 



Kozzy #12 Posted 11 July 2019 - 01:26 PM

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View PostSimeon85, on 11 July 2019 - 11:07 AM, said:

I think its a good change and have yet to see a good argument against this, people against this seem to happy people getting punished for others mistakes/anger, whereas this change protects the people it should be protecting, which is the thousands of players who get team damaged through no fault of their own.

 

 

This X 1000.

 

Being punished for other people's stupidity is so dumb.



jeffrey_mk2 #13 Posted 11 July 2019 - 01:44 PM

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Kozzy, on 11 July 2019 - 09:47 AM, said:


Except no one holds their shot?  If they did we wouldn't be having this change, would we?  I know I don't hold my shot, why should I?  As long as it's not going to throw the game I ALWAYS take the shot and so, it seems, does everyone else.


Not to be rude or something but you just said this in another topic , so you are fine to punish other people.
The amount of getting hit by an ally isnt even that big so I see no problem at all.
The players that dont care to hit others need to be changed , not the game features.



Kozzy #14 Posted 11 July 2019 - 02:00 PM

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View Postjeffrey_mk2, on 11 July 2019 - 12:44 PM, said:

Kozzy, on 11 July 2019 - 09:47 AM, said:


Except no one holds their shot?  If they did we wouldn't be having this change, would we?  I know I don't hold my shot, why should I?  As long as it's not going to throw the game I ALWAYS take the shot and so, it seems, does everyone else.


Not to be rude or something but you just said this in another topic , so you are fine to punish other people.
The amount of getting hit by an ally isnt even that big so I see no problem at all.
The players that dont care to hit others need to be changed , not the game features.
 

 

You are missing the point.  The game rewards taking those risky shots for virtually no penalty, using risk vs reward why wouldn't one take that shot?  The person taking the shot (and missing) is NOT getting punished for their mistake, the poor team mate is getting punished - which is stupid.  As it stands, the game makes it clear that taking the shot is nearly always the right thing to do so I (and countless others) do.

 

 



Zodiac1960s #15 Posted 11 July 2019 - 02:05 PM

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If you like team damage you can always drive off a cliff.

spamhamstar #16 Posted 11 July 2019 - 02:06 PM

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View PostSimeon85, on 11 July 2019 - 11:07 AM, said:

I think its a good change and have yet to see a good argument against this, people against this seem to happy people getting punished for others mistakes/anger, whereas this change protects the people it should be protecting, which is the thousands of players who get team damaged through no fault of their own.

 

I agree with the guy above, the people against this says something bad about the playerbase IMO like they feel they should have the right to dish out their own punishments. 

 

-------------------------------

 

 

That is the same argument that the gun lobbyists use to defend guns and its fundamentally a bad one.

 

Especially as there is no positive side to team damage anyway, it doesn't add anything to the game. 

 

There is everything wrong with the mechanic because it allows people who have done nothing wrong to have their games ruined by other player's carelessness or anger. For which the punishment are pretty irrelevant because prevention is always going to be better for the victim than punishment is. 

 

 

 

 

 

 

There are plenty of positives from team damage, from making the game more realistic to adding an extra dimension to game play.  Dumbing down the game again just because a few players can't behave is really sad.

 

View PostKozzy, on 11 July 2019 - 01:00 PM, said:

 

You are missing the point.  The game rewards taking those risky shots for virtually no penalty, using risk vs reward why wouldn't one take that shot?  The person taking the shot (and missing) is NOT getting punished for their mistake, the poor team mate is getting punished - which is stupid.  As it stands, the game makes it clear that taking the shot is nearly always the right thing to do so I (and countless others) do.

 

 

 

Except you do currently get punished for team damage, just not immediately.  You get fined for damage caused & you also get a mark against you.  Do this repeatedly & you'll quickly get punished. 

 

Removing the punishment is not going to stop players taking risky shots & just makes them even more "the right thing to do".  It also makes the game that little bit more ridiculous.  How much more do you think they need to remove or simplify before everyone is happy?

 



ValkyrionX #17 Posted 11 July 2019 - 02:12 PM

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imo , disabling the friendly fire in the random battles is only a good thing for the game environment and to avoid some toxicity 


Kozzy #18 Posted 11 July 2019 - 02:12 PM

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View Postspamhamstar, on 11 July 2019 - 01:06 PM, said:

 

There are plenty of positives from team damage, from making the game more realistic to adding an extra dimension to game play.  Dumbing down the game again just because a few players can't behave is really sad.

 

 

Except you do currently get punished for team damage, just not immediately.  You get fined for damage caused & you also get a mark against you.  Do this repeatedly & you'll quickly get punished. 

 

Removing the punishment is not going to stop players taking risky shots & just makes them even more "the right thing to do".  It also makes the game that little bit more ridiculous.  How much more do you think they need to remove or simplify before everyone is happy?

 

 

'Realism' along with all the other realistic aspect of this game?  If you think this game has anything remotely resembling realism then I have some bad news for you.  'Realism' in a game where there is none is a particularly weak argument.

 

Would you say the punishment stop accidental team damage?  It certainly doesn't stop me taking those shots and ruining some chap's game for my own benefit.

 

Don't remove the punishment, remove the stupid mechanic.  Also, as if having team damage on makes the game more complex or rewarding in any way, that is laughable.  I see a target I shoot the target, like everyone else.  All this without even mentioning intentional team damage...



Balc0ra #19 Posted 11 July 2019 - 02:19 PM

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View PostValkyrionX, on 11 July 2019 - 02:12 PM, said:

imo , disabling the friendly fire in the random battles is only a good thing for the game environment and to avoid some toxicity 

 

See... most arguments remain in chat. But most fire on someone just because they bumped into them out of spawn. Basically, they have a short fuse and want to vent some anger. And for some a shot doing nothing won't get that frustration out.

 

It's why I fear the toxicity part will just change into something different then simply going away. As console got rather creative with venting frustration once FF was turned off there. Tho in some cases. It will just be that shot regardless that do nothing. And that's the end of that. 



Simeon85 #20 Posted 11 July 2019 - 02:22 PM

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View Postspamhamstar, on 11 July 2019 - 11:06 PM, said:

 

There are plenty of positives from team damage, from making the game more realistic to adding an extra dimension to game play.  Dumbing down the game again just because a few players can't behave is really sad.

 

 

Except you do currently get punished for team damage, just not immediately.  You get fined for damage caused & you also get a mark against you.  Do this repeatedly & you'll quickly get punished. 

 

Removing the punishment is not going to stop players taking risky shots & just makes them even more "the right thing to do".  It also makes the game that little bit more ridiculous.  How much more do you think they need to remove or simplify before everyone is happy?

 

 

Realism is a pointless argument when its not a realistic game, I mean literally none of the other gameplay features are at all realistic so its no justification to keep one in that just annoys people and causes toxicity.

 

'Extra dimension to gameplay' what does that even mean? Extra annoyance is not something positive and that is all that it is, it just completely unnecessary player frustration and allows idiots to ruin games, for what? Nothing, it adds nothing at all, we've ween in frontline and ranked that the game goes along the same without it, most players barely noticed it was not there until it actually saved them from accidentally team damaging someone or some idiot got angry with them.

 

Those two modes have basically proven that removing it is a good idea and all the fearmongering about dumbing down the game, or trolling will go up, is just that, unfounded nonsense. 

 

And please the punishment does nothing, players can shoot you for huge alpha damage shots and all it costs them is a few thousand credits. 

 

Some idiot TD player doesn't like how you are spotting, so take like 90% of your HP, he won't turn blue, he won't get banned and your game is now basically screwed for no good reason.

 

And that is basically the sum of it, there is no good reason team damage is in this game and with it gone, people avoid having their game ruined. 

 

I'll repeat what I said earlier, people for this I can only presume want to have their own ability to dish out their own punishment to players they don't like or don't like how they are playing, which is just another good reason amongst many why this change is excellent. 

 


Edited by Simeon85, 11 July 2019 - 02:25 PM.





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