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Poll: Disabling Friendly Fire / Team Damage

friendly fire team damage

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Poll: Disabling Friendly Fire / Team Damage (214 members have cast votes)

You have to complete 250 battle in order to participate this poll.

Impressions on the proposed changes to friendly fire / team damage

  1. Very Good (58 votes [27.10%])

    Percentage of vote: 27.10%

  2. Good (20 votes [9.35%])

    Percentage of vote: 9.35%

  3. Indifferent (21 votes [9.81%])

    Percentage of vote: 9.81%

  4. Bad (32 votes [14.95%])

    Percentage of vote: 14.95%

  5. Very Bad (83 votes [38.79%])

    Percentage of vote: 38.79%

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Kozzy #41 Posted 12 July 2019 - 02:55 PM

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View Postspamhamstar, on 12 July 2019 - 01:48 PM, said:

 

Oh ffs, just because not everything in the game is realistic doesn't mean that making it even more unrealistic is a good thing.  That was my point, not that the game is realistic, so will you stop banging your head off that particular bandwagon.

 

But your argument for wanting it in because in doing so adds realism is weak, it gives the same weight to saying 'I don't want insta-repairs kits as they remove realism'.

 

View Postspamhamstar, on 12 July 2019 - 01:48 PM, said:

 

I got what you meant perfectly from your picture & have already answered you twice now, NO I wouldn't shoot if there was a risk of hitting a team mate.

 

 

Ok thanks for clearing that up; you wouldn't take a shot even if there was a 0.1% risk of hitting a team mate.  Interesting.

 

View Postspamhamstar, on 12 July 2019 - 01:48 PM, said:

 

Try reading instead of patronising.  You seem a little confused about the differences between an arcade game, a simulation game & actual reality.

 

Just to be clear, which of those three options do you think best describes the game?



Maschinenkanone #42 Posted 12 July 2019 - 03:02 PM

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If WG really think that friendly fire is a problem and needs to be tackled then why dont they do exactly this, namely preventing friendly fire from happening? With their planned approach they just prevent friendly DAMAGE, friendly FIRE will still be possible (and certainly used by trolls to keep molesting their victims).

 

A much better solution would be to just implement mode SAFE SHOT.

- Friendly fire would not be possible (instead of just preventing damage from friendly fire)

- unintentional friendy fire would still be possible (thereby keeping an interesting game feature and appeasing the realism faction)


 

 



Simeon85 #43 Posted 12 July 2019 - 03:14 PM

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View PostMaschinenkanone, on 13 July 2019 - 12:02 AM, said:

If WG really think that friendly fire is a problem and needs to be tackled then why dont they do exactly this, namely preventing friendly fire from happening? With their planned approach they just prevent friendly DAMAGE, friendly FIRE will still be possible (and certainly used by trolls to keep molesting their victims).

 

A much better solution would be to just implement mode SAFE SHOT.

- Friendly fire would not be possible (instead of just preventing damage from friendly fire)

- unintentional friendy fire would still be possible (thereby keeping an interesting game feature and appeasing the realism faction)


 

 

 

How is it an 'interesting game feature'?

 

Someone fires at an enemy gets some weird accuracy RNG, shot flies off outside the circle, I am driving off next to the target in my light or whatever and drive into this shot, take big damage.

 

I don't find that interesting, I just find that annoying. 



onderschepper #44 Posted 12 July 2019 - 03:38 PM

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View PostKozzy, on 12 July 2019 - 01:35 PM, said:

 

 Interesting.  You quoted the question but didn't provide an answer.

 

 

 

That would be because your question used a quote which does not appear on the World of Tanks website, which is where the product description exists.

 

Based upon a quick Google search the only references to your quote are on third party websites, with no clear and definitive indication that Wargaming were the ones who made the claim (as opposed to a reviewer/ similar, which WG then quoted because it sounded good at the time).

 

The only quote I can find which is remotely close is "World Leading Warfare MMO", which is from the description of the Collector's Edition.

 

¯\_(ツ)_/¯



spamhamstar #45 Posted 12 July 2019 - 03:47 PM

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View PostKozzy, on 12 July 2019 - 01:55 PM, said:

 

But your argument for wanting it in because in doing so adds realism is weak, it gives the same weight to saying 'I don't want insta-repairs kits as they remove realism'.

 

 

 

It makes about as much sense as your argument that because we have other unrealistic things in the game then anything goes, even magical bullets to make the game even more noob friendly.  Why not just implement huge markers to show exactly where you've been shot from as well, oh wait...

 

View PostKozzy, on 12 July 2019 - 01:55 PM, said:

 

Ok thanks for clearing that up; you wouldn't take a shot even if there was a 0.1% risk of hitting a team mate.  Interesting.

 

I didn't clear anything up, I simply repeated what I'd said in 2 previous posts.

 

View PostKozzy, on 12 July 2019 - 01:55 PM, said:

Just to be clear, which of those three options do you think best describes the game?

 

There's no point in me answering that question if you don't know what the 3 options mean.

Kozzy #46 Posted 12 July 2019 - 03:54 PM

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View Postonderschepper, on 12 July 2019 - 02:38 PM, said:

 

That would be because your question used a quote which does not appear on the World of Tanks website, which is where the product description exists.

 

Based upon a quick Google search the only references to your quote are on third party websites, with no clear and definitive indication that Wargaming were the ones who made the claim (as opposed to a reviewer/ similar, which WG then quoted because it sounded good at the time).

 

The only quote I can find which is remotely close is "World Leading Warfare MMO", which is from the description of the Collector's Edition.

 

¯\_(ツ)_/¯

 

 

 

¯\_(ツ)_/¯

 

View Postspamhamstar, on 12 July 2019 - 02:47 PM, said:

 

It makes about as much sense as your argument that because we have other unrealistic things in the game then anything goes, even magical bullets to make the game even more noob friendly.  Why not just implement huge markers to show exactly where you've been shot from as well, oh wait...

 

 

​Again, you brought up realism in a game that features very little of it as a reason to retain a feature that the game creators have shown an interest in removing.  You adding unrealistic items to the already huge list doesn't help your argument at all, quite the contrary.

 

View Postspamhamstar, on 12 July 2019 - 02:47 PM, said:

 

I didn't clear anything up, I simply repeated what I'd said in 2 previous posts.

 

 

Yeah you did.  You started by making out the example shot was not optimal and that one would be better off aiming elsewhere on the enemy tank when the point of the image was to ask about risk assessment on a snap decision.  This is how you first answered:

 

View Postspamhamstar, on 12 July 2019 - 

 

'd have expected with your stats & all your games at tier 7 in the e25, you'd know where to shoot a side on tiger.

 

​Which wasn't the point of the question.  You later clarified by saying you would not take the shot due to the risk of hitting a friendly.

 

View Postspamhamstar, on 12 July 2019 - 02:47 PM, said:

 

There's no point in me answering that question if you don't know what the 3 options mean.

 

​I dare you to answer it, if not for me (because I clearly don't know the difference) then for the others reading this thread.

 


Edited by Kozzy, 12 July 2019 - 04:10 PM.


Steve8066 #47 Posted 12 July 2019 - 04:14 PM

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Their `solution` of removing it is basically them admitting that their auto system doesnt work. The problem is that the supposed solution is just them been too lazy to fix it properly.

Edited by Steve8066, 12 July 2019 - 04:20 PM.


spamhamstar #48 Posted 12 July 2019 - 04:16 PM

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View PostKozzy, on 12 July 2019 - 02:54 PM, said:

 

 

 

¯\_(ツ)_/¯

 

 

​Again, you brought up realism in a game that features very little of it as a reason to retain a feature that the game creators have shown an interest in removing.  You adding unrealistic items to the already huge list doesn't help your argument at all, quite the contrary.

 

 

Yeah you did.  You started by making out the example shot was not optimal and that one would be better off aiming elsewhere on the enemy tank when the point of the image was to ask about risk assessment on a snap decision.  This is how you first answered:

 

 

​Which wasn't the point of the question.  You later clarified by saying you would not take the shot due to the risk of hitting a friendly.

 

 

​I dare you to answer it, if not for me (because I clearly don't know the difference) then for the others reading this thread.

 

 

You're right, me pointing out other ridiculous things that WG have added to the game in some way makes turning off team damage make more sense.

 

So you know all that yet continued to rabbit on about the silly little picture you drew?  You were answered 100% in my 1st reply but apparently I had to say the same thing 3 times before it registerred.

 

I seriously doubt that most people are bothering with this conversation.  However, it's worth noting that the majority of players that have bothered to vote agree that this change is for the worse.



Kozzy #49 Posted 12 July 2019 - 04:22 PM

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View Postspamhamstar, on 12 July 2019 - 03:16 PM, said:

 

You're right, me pointing out other ridiculous things that WG have added to the game in some way makes turning off team damage make more sense.

 

So you know all that yet continued to rabbit on about the silly little picture you drew?  You were answered 100% in my 1st reply but apparently I had to say the same thing 3 times before it registerred.

 

I seriously doubt that most people are bothering with this conversation.  However, it's worth noting that the majority of players that have bothered to vote agree that this change is for the worse.

 

So you admit pointing it out is pointless?  Excellent we can move on from 'realism' in a not realistic game being a bit of a silly argument.

 

You said two different things, actually.  just as I quoted.  I even quoted the first thing back to you.

 

I wonder why you don't really want to answer it, other than some faux care about what other people don't care about,..  Your faith in WoT forum polls is, for want of a better word 'cute'.



onderschepper #50 Posted 12 July 2019 - 04:47 PM

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View PostKozzy, on 12 July 2019 - 03:54 PM, said:

 

Weird.jpg

 

Using the same URL, signed out, accessed via Release and Beta versions of FireFox (Beta version has never been signed into anything).

 

???????????..........Weird :D

 



spamhamstar #51 Posted 13 July 2019 - 01:36 AM

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View PostKozzy, on 12 July 2019 - 03:22 PM, said:

 

So you admit pointing it out is pointless?  Excellent we can move on from 'realism' in a not realistic game being a bit of a silly argument.

 

You said two different things, actually.  just as I quoted.  I even quoted the first thing back to you.

 

I wonder why you don't really want to answer it, other than some faux care about what other people don't care about,..  Your faith in WoT forum polls is, for want of a better word 'cute'.

 

I'm assuming English isn't your 1st language or are you just being deliberately obtuse?

 

Actually, I answered your sepcific question & then I elaborated as it appeared your specific question wasn't what you really meant.  As it turned out I was correct.  This is the 1st time I've had someone crying over getting too full an answer.

 

There's been plenty of points you've failed to address & seeing as you have such faith in WG then we're just going to have to take their word for it & accept that the game is meant to be a simulator.



Baldrickk #52 Posted 23 July 2019 - 03:15 PM

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View PostSimeon85, on 12 July 2019 - 03:14 PM, said:

 

How is it an 'interesting game feature'?

 

Someone fires at an enemy gets some weird accuracy RNG, shot flies off outside the circle, I am driving off next to the target in my light or whatever and drive into this shot, take big damage.

 

I don't find that interesting, I just find that annoying. 

And you've never  benefited from the inverse?

Never used an enemy tank to shield yourself from his allies as you've killed it?

 

Hmmmm....

And that's just kill shots.

What about non kill shots?

What about all the shots that were not fired because they might otherwise hit an ally instead of you?


Edited by Baldrickk, 23 July 2019 - 03:16 PM.


Balc0ra #53 Posted 23 July 2019 - 03:32 PM

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After playing CT for a bit. And how... some got creative there. I've still seen people turn blue in some cases unlike console that has it all off. But that's CT. CT was always excessive, even with TD on. Pushing someone off a cliff or drown them, you get blue if your the last one that had contact. Much like now etc.

 

But one big issue I have that I'm not sure will change vs CT to live. Is friendly arty stun. It happens a lot on CT. Enemy HT's push into you, and arty fires away. Then having a longer reload is gonna hurt me way more. And I got hit a lot by it. And not one turned blue beside one. That fired 3 clips on his Lorr arty on me before he turned. No enemy near. Just because he could. That's way too much tbh if friendly stuns will remain. And I don't know how much he did it before that match. If any at all. So stunning a scout that won't scout here and there is fine then with that huge of a leeway vs 3 shots of TD now.



OmniWalou #54 Posted 23 July 2019 - 03:55 PM

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View PostBaldrickk, on 23 July 2019 - 03:15 PM, said:

And you've never  benefited from the inverse?

Never used an enemy tank to shield yourself from his allies as you've killed it?

 

Hmmmm....

And that's just kill shots.

What about non kill shots?

What about all the shots that were not fired because they might otherwise hit an ally instead of you?

 

And you can't feel at all for those 17 people who were killed, or for those who were shot by a teammate and had their battle ruined? Or for those who had their battle ruined cause someone accidentally hit or bumped into a friendly and it put into motion a fight within the team? Or any other scenario of FF being used in a toxic manner or it was accidentally caused?

 

I remember those few threads here, about how arty was being TKed and people here laughed and cheered about it, and supported it... That is this representative of this community and why it doesn't deserve to have FF turned on. Those who commented there in such manner can thank themselves as they are part of the problem that is being fixed.



Baldrickk #55 Posted 24 July 2019 - 08:07 AM

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View PostOmniWalou, on 23 July 2019 - 03:55 PM, said:

 

And you can't feel at all for those 17 people who were killed, or for those who were shot by a teammate and had their battle ruined? Or for those who had their battle ruined cause someone accidentally hit or bumped into a friendly and it put into motion a fight within the team? Or any other scenario of FF being used in a toxic manner or it was accidentally caused?

 

I remember those few threads here, about how arty was being TKed and people here laughed and cheered about it, and supported it... That is this representative of this community and why it doesn't deserve to have FF turned on. Those who commented there in such manner can thank themselves as they are part of the problem that is being fixed.

Oh yeah,  17 in over 27,000 battles. 

Such a problem. 



tajj7 #56 Posted 24 July 2019 - 09:50 AM

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View PostBaldrickk, on 24 July 2019 - 07:07 AM, said:

Oh yeah,  17 in over 27,000 battles. 

Such a problem. 

 

Still not a necessary or interesting feature though is it. Also if it happens so rarely, its not really adding anything to the game, which comes back to heart of the issue that team damage generally only brings negative results to a players gaming experience.  

 

Someone shoots you accidentally and someone shoots you on purpose, those are basically the two main ways people experience team damage in game, and generally all that brings is frustration.

 

Take it away, and you take some frustration away, which IMO in a game that is filled with things that can annoy you, is a good thing. 

 

I can play lights and not have to worry about some terrible TD player camping in base who thinks because I have not suicide scouted for him he has the right to take most if not all of my HP from me and ruin my game.  Stuff like that going away improve my gameplay experience, and the extremely rare scenarios where I benefit from enemy friendly fire is not going to balance that out. 



Baldrickk #57 Posted 24 July 2019 - 12:26 PM

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View Posttajj7, on 24 July 2019 - 09:50 AM, said:

 

Still not a necessary or interesting feature though is it. Also if it happens so rarely, its not really adding anything to the game, which comes back to heart of the issue that team damage generally only brings negative results to a players gaming experience.  

 

Someone shoots you accidentally and someone shoots you on purpose, those are basically the two main ways people experience team damage in game, and generally all that brings is frustration.

 

Take it away, and you take some frustration away, which IMO in a game that is filled with things that can annoy you, is a good thing. 

 

I can play lights and not have to worry about some terrible TD player camping in base who thinks because I have not suicide scouted for him he has the right to take most if not all of my HP from me and ruin my game.  Stuff like that going away improve my gameplay experience, and the extremely rare scenarios where I benefit from enemy friendly fire is not going to balance that out. 

Not necessary?

Have you just been ignoring all my posts or something?

It adds depth to the game. It allows you to effectively use enemies as cover as their allies actively need to avoid shooting their allies.

There's a reason that "friendly fire off" settings are seen in the same way in gaming as gutter bumpers in 10-pin-bowling.

 

Yes it's frustrating to be shot,  it's frustrating to be tackled in football too, or have a collision with another player, on your team or otherwise,  but you wouldn't ask FIFA devs to make it so players ghost through each other,  would you?

 

It's frustrating for another tank to have a hard counter to yours, so let's do something about that too.

Let's get rid of all tanks and have just the one.

Oh, RNG is frustrating too. Let's make all guns hitscan instead.   That also gets rid of that frustrating shell velocity issue where you have to lead a target.

Oh, and it's frustrating when you're shot by ranks you can't see, so we'll do away with soft cover too, and the entire spotting mechanism while we're at it.

 

Where does it end?

Dumbing down reduces depth, which reduces possibilities, which reduces fun. 

 

Frustration when things go wrong is a counterpoint to the good feeling you get when things go right.  You can't have one without the other. 

 

And you keep bringing up how often you get shot by allies in your light tanks. 

How about you provide some examples because that never happens to me in mine. 



IntruderFI #58 Posted 24 July 2019 - 05:59 PM

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View PostYakito, on 11 July 2019 - 11:23 AM, said:

You literally just proved that team damage needs to be disabled and there's nothing good about it at all. 

 

So you just proved you are one of those who push tanks out of cover and in other ways disrupt game play.

spamhamstar #59 Posted 24 July 2019 - 06:19 PM

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View PostBaldrickk, on 24 July 2019 - 11:26 AM, said:

Not necessary?

Have you just been ignoring all my posts or something?

It adds depth to the game. It allows you to effectively use enemies as cover as their allies actively need to avoid shooting their allies.

There's a reason that "friendly fire off" settings are seen in the same way in gaming as gutter bumpers in 10-pin-bowling.

 

Yes it's frustrating to be shot,  it's frustrating to be tackled in football too, or have a collision with another player, on your team or otherwise,  but you wouldn't ask FIFA devs to make it so players ghost through each other,  would you?

 

It's frustrating for another tank to have a hard counter to yours, so let's do something about that too.

Let's get rid of all tanks and have just the one.

Oh, RNG is frustrating too. Let's make all guns hitscan instead.   That also gets rid of that frustrating shell velocity issue where you have to lead a target.

Oh, and it's frustrating when you're shot by ranks you can't see, so we'll do away with soft cover too, and the entire spotting mechanism while we're at it.

 

Where does it end?

Dumbing down reduces depth, which reduces possibilities, which reduces fun. 

 

Frustration when things go wrong is a counterpoint to the good feeling you get when things go right.  You can't have one without the other. 

 

And you keep bringing up how often you get shot by allies in your light tanks. 

How about you provide some examples because that never happens to me in mine. 

 

This.

 

How ridiculously easy do they need to make the game before it's noob friendly enough?  We already had giant markers to show exactly where you were shot from just in case you'd been outplayed.  We used to have maps with varying elevations but 3 dimensions were too difficult for some.

 

Now we lose team damage to prevent pesky good players from hiding behind our allies.

 

Next?  Can drive through allies to prevent pushing?  Aimbots for everyone so we can all snap shot like a unicum?  No bushes cuz bushes are OP?  Remove all armour & speed up tanks so we have another CoD clone?  YAY


Edited by spamhamstar, 24 July 2019 - 06:36 PM.


thestaggy #60 Posted 25 July 2019 - 08:02 AM

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Bad idea.

 

Griefers, especially if they are in a bigger, heavier tank, can now bully others at will. I can even see griefing increasing because now players know there are no risks on their part.

 

Should've just implemented a mechanic where your first two shots deal damage to friendlies and from the third shot you take the damage you are trying to inflict on others. At this point your tank turns blue and any damage you try and deal to an ally is removed from your HP pool. You remain blue for 24-hours and the only friendly damage you can deal is to yourself.






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