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High Tiers equipped with machine guns

machine gun luchs leopard

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zegumo #1 Posted 10 August 2019 - 08:29 PM

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Hi!

I was just wondering why tanks equipped with machine guns only go up to Tier 5 - Leopard.

 

Why not a single Tier 8 or even Tier 6?

 

Is there a special meaningful reason for this?

 

Thanks!

 

zegumo[S-D-G]



NekoPuffer_PPP #2 Posted 10 August 2019 - 08:38 PM

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It would break some Personal Missions requiring you to shoot enemy tanks a certain number of times, i.e. it would make them too easy.

 

Besides, it's hard to balance such a mechanic and there's more important matters at hand...


Edited by NekoPuffer_PPP, 10 August 2019 - 08:39 PM.


fwhaatpiraat #3 Posted 10 August 2019 - 08:55 PM

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Because they don't have enough penetration. Mt-25 did have an autocannon, but it had abysmal penetration.

 

Edit: 51 and 88 if you were skilled pressed 2, not even that bad though.


Edited by fwhaatpiraat, 10 August 2019 - 08:56 PM.


GreatSuprendo #4 Posted 10 August 2019 - 09:24 PM

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WG can't even balance what they have, so lets not introduce 'super reloaders'

Balc0ra #5 Posted 10 August 2019 - 09:37 PM

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View Postfwhaatpiraat, on 10 August 2019 - 08:55 PM, said:

Because they don't have enough penetration. Mt-25 did have an autocannon, but it had abysmal penetration.

 

Tbh that gun was the only reason to keep the MT-25. It had 1500 DPM, a 30 round clip with 40 damage per shot, and 9 seconds to empty it. But with 46mm pen "62mm gold pen" It would not dominate even lower tiers as easy. As not many of the rounds did damage. And it was a 37mm. So it would not overmatch much. But still, if you got behind a Borsig, that clip in the turret would make you laugh each time.

 

That gun would still be fine today tbh with a minor tweak. 

 

 


Edited by Balc0ra, 10 August 2019 - 09:39 PM.


Nishi_Kinuyo #6 Posted 10 August 2019 - 09:55 PM

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Because it'd be a bit wonky to balance for one, and rather dumb as well imo.

Paul_Kouadio #7 Posted 10 August 2019 - 10:59 PM

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WG devs said no high-tier autocannons will feature in-game in a recent QnA. I have no clue why though, although they did mention 'modern armament' as something they didn't want to introduce into the game, somewhere in that QnA. If they were allowed, I'm sure the British lights would be far more interesting...

Nishi_Kinuyo #8 Posted 10 August 2019 - 11:34 PM

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View PostPaul_Kouadio, on 10 August 2019 - 10:59 PM, said:

WG devs said no high-tier autocannons will feature in-game in a recent QnA. I have no clue why though, although they did mention 'modern armament' as something they didn't want to introduce into the game, somewhere in that QnA. If they were allowed, I'm sure the British lights would be far more interesting...

Interesting, as in even more rubbish?

Just imagine the FV107 Scimitar with its 30mm RARDEN.

Since it is 30mm, the damage per shell can't be high, and realistically speaking, it can load only 6 shells at once, which further limits its damage output.

So lets take a rather high alpha for its calibre... 70 or something¹, which would put its clip output at... 420 tops.

And that is assuming that all shells both hit and penetrate the target.

Since it is an autocannon, its range is likely to also be limited similar to all other (lowtier) autocannons are, at 400m max.

¹70 being imo rather high for 30mm guns, considering the VK16 has only 30 alpha on its 30mm autocannon, while the Chi-Ha gets 70 for its 47mm. The AMX 13-57 gets 90 alpha on its 57mm as a comparison.

 

How do you envision something like that to be better for gameplay than the 105mm gun (390 alpha) on the Manticore?



fwhaatpiraat #9 Posted 10 August 2019 - 11:43 PM

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View PostBalc0ra, on 10 August 2019 - 09:37 PM, said:

 

Tbh that gun was the only reason to keep the MT-25. It had 1500 DPM, a 30 round clip with 40 damage per shot, and 9 seconds to empty it. But with 46mm pen "62mm gold pen" It would not dominate even lower tiers as easy. As not many of the rounds did damage. And it was a 37mm. So it would not overmatch much. But still, if you got behind a Borsig, that clip in the turret would make you laugh each time.

 

That gun would still be fine today tbh with a minor tweak. 

 

 


Didn't see the right values even, so its 62mm. That is barely enough for the side or rear of a Panther.



Desyatnik_Pansy #10 Posted 10 August 2019 - 11:46 PM

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View Postfwhaatpiraat, on 10 August 2019 - 08:55 PM, said:

Because they don't have enough penetration. Mt-25 did have an autocannon, but it had abysmal penetration.

 

Edit: 51 and 88 if you were skilled pressed 2, not even that bad though.

 

Give back 59-16 Autoloader with the old stats. :hiding:



WindSplitter1 #11 Posted 11 August 2019 - 12:16 AM

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View PostDesyatnik_Pansy, on 10 August 2019 - 10:46 PM, said:

 

Give back 59-16 Autoloader with the old stats. :hiding:


I second this motion.

 

@Ontopic: WG stated new technology (in this case, autocannons) would render old ones obsolete. Personally, I find it quite of a stupid excuse.

 

Overheat mechanic could probably work.



Xandania #12 Posted 11 August 2019 - 08:18 AM

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View PostDesyatnik_Pansy, on 10 August 2019 - 10:46 PM, said:

 

Give back 59-16 Autoloader with the old stats. :hiding:


That was the sole reason I loved that tank - not enough pen to hurt most tanks frontally, but of you got into their weak spots, oh my did they suffer *evilgrin*

 

Now it does damage way more reliably, but it completely lost its uniqueness....



arthurwellsley #13 Posted 11 August 2019 - 09:43 AM

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View PostDesyatnik_Pansy, on 10 August 2019 - 10:46 PM, said:

 

Give back 59-16 Autoloader with the old stats. :hiding:

 

View PostXandania, on 11 August 2019 - 07:18 AM, said:


That was the sole reason I loved that tank - not enough pen to hurt most tanks frontally, but of you got into their weak spots, oh my did they suffer *evilgrin*

 

Now it does damage way more reliably, but it completely lost its uniqueness....

 

I too enjoyed the 59-16 and wish it had it's auto loader back.

 

The only tank that now that has a silly autoloader at a higher tier is the AMX 13 57 with the funky looking needle gun. That tank used to be so underwhelming with the old +3 MM, but now it's only +2 it's become a joy.


Edited by arthurwellsley, 11 August 2019 - 09:43 AM.


WindSplitter1 #14 Posted 11 August 2019 - 02:10 PM

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View Postarthurwellsley, on 11 August 2019 - 08:43 AM, said:

 

 

I too enjoyed the 59-16 and wish it had it's auto loader back.

 

The only tank that now that has a silly autoloader at a higher tier is the AMX 13 57 with the funky looking needle gun. That tank used to be so underwhelming with the old +3 MM, but now it's only +2 it's become a joy.


Unfortunately, that's the way it is now.

 

Old premium LTs or XP+Credits piñatas.



vasilinhorulezz #15 Posted 11 August 2019 - 02:18 PM

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Because those gun will be useless in the game, they were developed to engage BMPs, not IS 7s.

ExclamationMark #16 Posted 11 August 2019 - 03:43 PM

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One could almost consider the 13 57 a machine-gun tank... Or at least, the closest an autoloader is to becoming one. 

 

AT7 similarly has such an autoloader. Both tanks have 1s intra-clip reload. 



Balc0ra #17 Posted 11 August 2019 - 04:12 PM

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View Postarthurwellsley, on 11 August 2019 - 09:43 AM, said:

 

 

I too enjoyed the 59-16 and wish it had it's auto loader back.

 

The only tank that now that has a silly autoloader at a higher tier is the AMX 13 57 with the funky looking needle gun. That tank used to be so underwhelming with the old +3 MM, but now it's only +2 it's become a joy.

 

59-16 gun would not even be strong today with the new MM. It had "meh" DPM and terrible pen. So it's not like it would dominate vs even the 12t. 

 

13 57 is even more broken with the new MM. It was balanced for +3 and never seeing top tier. Now he sees +0 games often. Idk why they still sell it. It's not a rare sight either. Even more so with the new UK lights to farm.



fwhaatpiraat #18 Posted 11 August 2019 - 04:14 PM

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View PostBalc0ra, on 11 August 2019 - 04:12 PM, said:

 

59-16 gun would not even be strong today with the new MM. It had "meh" DPM and terrible pen. So it's not like it would dominate vs even the 12t. 

 

13 57 is even more broken with the new MM. It was balanced for +3 and never seeing top tier. Now he sees +0 games often. Idk why they still sell it. It's not a rare sight either. Even more so with the new UK lights to farm.

The gun of the 59-16 was really strong vs Cromwells in skirmishes. Really funny also.



Balc0ra #19 Posted 11 August 2019 - 05:19 PM

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View Postfwhaatpiraat, on 11 August 2019 - 04:14 PM, said:

The gun of the 59-16 was really strong vs Cromwells in skirmishes. Really funny also.

 

Prehaps. But in general for randoms with Steve that can't even afford gold ammo? Not really.



Nishi_Kinuyo #20 Posted 11 August 2019 - 07:55 PM

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View PostExclamationMark, on 11 August 2019 - 03:43 PM, said:

One could almost consider the 13 57 a machine-gun tank... Or at least, the closest an autoloader is to becoming one. 

 

AT7 similarly has such an autoloader. Both tanks have 1s intra-clip reload. 

Most importantly, you forgot about the third tier 7 autoloader with that feature:

The Type 5 Medium Tank Chi-Ri.

https://tanks.gg/com...02120__21.-1.-1






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