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Can someone explain me?


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cro001 #1 Posted 25 September 2019 - 06:55 PM

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Can someone explain me what does the AMX M4 54 do except being HT version of Manticore? The funniest thing about it is that it has been in game for 2(!) years unchanged and it is hilariously bad. Not even tier for tier but just comparing the hard stats, tier 9 heavies are better than it. No kidding, compare it to Conqueror and Conqueror has similar or better stats tier lower.

Miepie #2 Posted 25 September 2019 - 07:43 PM

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View Postcro001, on 25 September 2019 - 06:55 PM, said:

Can someone explain me what does the AMX M4 54 do except being HT version of Manticore? The funniest thing about it is that it has been in game for 2(!) years unchanged and it is hilariously bad. Not even tier for tier but just comparing the hard stats, tier 9 heavies are better than it. No kidding, compare it to Conqueror and Conqueror has similar or better stats tier lower.

Yeah, but with that 130 mm gun it LOOKS totally badass... Surely there are some people that will grind it for that reason? Plus, it gives the completionists something to do. :justwait:

 

(disclaimer: my French HT experience is limited to the BDR G1B which I like and the Somua SM which I want to like but which seems to dislike me; is that why it is called SM?)



XxKuzkina_MatxX #3 Posted 26 September 2019 - 12:05 AM

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The AMX 54 is a case of arrested development. The line stops at tier 9 which is a very good heavy.



Bordhaw #4 Posted 26 September 2019 - 10:26 AM

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View Postcro001, on 25 September 2019 - 05:55 PM, said:

Can someone explain me what does the AMX M4 54 do except being HT version of Manticore? The funniest thing about it is that it has been in game for 2(!) years unchanged and it is hilariously bad. Not even tier for tier but just comparing the hard stats, tier 9 heavies are better than it. No kidding, compare it to Conqueror and Conqueror has similar or better stats tier lower.

 

Where does it say a Tier 10 has to be better than a Tier 9 ? 



demon_tank #5 Posted 26 September 2019 - 11:17 AM

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View PostBordhaw, on 26 September 2019 - 09:26 AM, said:

 

Where does it say a Tier 10 has to be better than a Tier 9 ? 

The whole logic of the game is that as you progress within the tiers the tanks get better and better.

Of course being better "tier for tier" is a different story.

 

The tier X amx m4 54 does need a slight buff but so do many other tier 8 , 9 and 10 tanks.

Nothing new here with WG and balance.



fwhaatpiraat #6 Posted 26 September 2019 - 11:29 AM

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I never played that tank, so hard to tell, but I can give guess. I agree that on paper the parameters of the AMX look pretty bad compared to the Super Conqueror. SC is better at pretty much everything, right? But is the SC the main competitor of the AMX? I don't know, it might be though. It could also be compared with the Pz VII and the E100. Although those 2 are considered as 'super heavies' and much much slower. And that is what the power of the AMX could be (I think). It is ofcourse noticably faster than those German heavies, but also faster than the SC (at least tanks.gg shows that).

 

Even though (statistically) I'm doing better in the SC than in the T110E5, I just like playing the E5 more because of the better mobility. It is closer to a medium tank than the SC, which fits my playstyle. The SC has better dpm and a better gun in general and barely a weakspot on the top of the turret which makes it great for hull down and defensive (digging in) gameplay. But still, playing the E5 is just more fun imo and fits me more. And that could also be the case for the AMX I think. On paper it has a 25% (hard ground) to 50% (medium and soft ground) better traverse speed and 25% better power to weight ratio. That could be the difference between annoyingly slow (but better tank) and a decently fast heavy tank (which is big and has a flawed gun). I have the same with the M48 Patton versus the M60. M48 has better armor overall and better dpm, but the mobility of the M60 just is thát good, which makes it such a pleasure to play, at least for me. M48 just feels really sluggish (the low profile, stealthy 430U with much better armor easily drives past you btw)) ), which also makes it harder to dodge arta.

 

Not really saying the AMX is good, the low dpm and bad premium shell probably cause frustration in certain situations, but still the play style might attract people.



tajj7 #7 Posted 26 September 2019 - 11:38 AM

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I think if it had better standard pen and better premium pen it would be fine. 

 

Because 560 alpha on a decently mobile heavy, that is strong hull down and still has pretty strong frontal armour, and has -8 gun depression gives it a role that doesn't really exist on tier 10.

 

Far more alpha and way more mobile than an SC, with a much stronger lower plate allowing it to bully tier 8s and 9s, and much bigger gun and smaller turret weakspot than the E5.

 

Whilst also being more mobile and having similar armour ton the likes of the Panzer VII and Type 5 that have similar alpha guns.

 

But this is all let down by that 250 AP pen and 280 premium AP,  in the current meta of armour power creep, 280 AP doesn't cut it, it needs to be 300 minimum maybe like 310mm penetration AP and the standard round needs to be 258 at least is not not 264 AP like the 120mm gun has. 

 

Then I think it would be fine, but currently the bad pen pushes people to use the 120mm, which is where it starts looking inferior to an SC or even an E5 as they share that alpha but have better DPM/gun handling etc.

 

 






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