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Why does WG make maps which give one team great paths and positions and th other can *edited itself.


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killer999death #1 Posted 05 October 2019 - 03:24 PM

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Redshire, why does the South team get a sniping position on the hill towards North team's heavy tank route but North team does not get a sniping position on South's heavy tank route. South HTs can make it safely to the zeppelin brawling position while North's are *edited by TD's always camping the circled hill. I lost 60+% HP in that battle even before I got onto the platform created by WG to give HT's a small battle arena (because that's what WG does in all maps, makes small battle arenas for HT's etc. which creates hideous maps).

 

 

 

 

Another map I find absolutely retardedly unfair is Himmelsdorf.

 

 

Why do you have to choke North team's acces to castle platform but give a safe passage to South team? Who at Wargaming said ''Hey this is fair to both teams'' When every damn battle players rush onto that platform and if one team gets choked it's over, it's *edited!

Same crapwith Mines, I had a topic on that one already with fixes for the hill etc. 


 



NUKLEAR_SLUG #2 Posted 05 October 2019 - 03:46 PM

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Why does it matter? It's not like you only ever get to play from one side so whatever side you end up on adjust your play accordingly. 

Balc0ra #3 Posted 05 October 2019 - 03:50 PM

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Indeed most maps are not symmetrical. As you get one advantage on one part of the map. The other team still gets one on a different part of the map. On Himmelsdorf of you look at what you marked, and then look at the 1 lane at what North has to name one. And on Redshire, the buildings that gave South cover from TD hill. Can also give North cover when they win the HT lane to push cap. And South still has that open area to cross vs TD guns once they win the HT lane.



tajj7 #4 Posted 05 October 2019 - 03:55 PM

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Mines, spawn south, lose most of the time, much fun.

Fjords, spawn west, lost most of the time, much fun.

Live Oaks, south spawn wins the rail side most of the time and then the game. 

 

It's quite weird they removed average maps like Stalingrad that were well balanced but leave in maps that horribly balanced to one team.  



8126Jakobsson #5 Posted 05 October 2019 - 04:00 PM

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That's just how they roll. Maybe it's to ensure a victory for all kinds of players. Empires Border encounter might be worst of them all though. 

Edited by 8126Jakobsson, 05 October 2019 - 04:00 PM.


unhappy_bunny #6 Posted 05 October 2019 - 04:08 PM

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Perhaps it would be a good idea not to rush to that spot but hang back and tempt the enemy out into a more open area. 

As for Himmelsdorf, I often see the North spawn get the advantage if they can reach the top of the hill in numbers.

 



killer999death #7 Posted 05 October 2019 - 04:08 PM

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View Posttajj7, on 05 October 2019 - 03:55 PM, said:

Mines, spawn south, lose most of the time, much fun.

Fjords, spawn west, lost most of the time, much fun.

Live Oaks, south spawn wins the rail side most of the time and then the game. 

 

It's quite weird they removed average maps like Stalingrad that were well balanced but leave in maps that horribly balanced to one team.  

 

I quite liked Stalingrad because heavy tanks had more cover and routes to use than let's say 1 big and 1 small rock arena and the medium lane had houses too with 2 different elevations. A lot of people hated Stalingrad but it was actually one of the more flexible maps out there and it's a bloody city map. Granted light tanks were screwed but could still do damage on distracted enemies or doing drive by's like it's a GTA mission.

 

Now WG makes 2 or 3 lane maps like it's League of Legends and places small arenas for HTs to fight on.  Studzianki is an example of a bad map, it looks like someone created it because he skipped his 20 minute break and didn't know what to do so he created it. Empire's border is also a bad mapas it has only 2 and a half lanes with a platform for the teams to clash on. 

View PostBalc0ra, on 05 October 2019 - 03:50 PM, said:

Indeed most maps are not symmetrical. As you get one advantage on one part of the map. The other team still gets one on a different part of the map. On Himmelsdorf of you look at what you marked, and then look at the 1 lane at what North has to name one. And on Redshire, the buildings that gave South cover from TD hill. Can also give North cover when they win the HT lane to push cap. And South still has that open area to cross vs TD guns once they win the HT lane.



Yeah but the train station is not as powerful as the castle platform has complete vision over the streets below and if you are like me you use the terrain + cracked wall to shoot anything down on the horizontal street. 

 

 

 

 

When they do they still need to drive out of the funnel and before you get to those houses it's still open ground. South has a much easier time getting out of it because once you drop into the water you can climb up the hill and usually spot all the TD's camping on hill. The only thing South has to worry is TD's camping where Waffle IV and Leopard are in my map. That's the only thing.


Edited by flashmove_iron, 07 October 2019 - 09:44 AM.
This post has been edited by the moderation team due to red text use.


mpf1959 #8 Posted 05 October 2019 - 04:15 PM

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Life is a two way street, or was it a bowl of cornflakes? Anyway, someone said it! 

8126Jakobsson #9 Posted 05 October 2019 - 04:18 PM

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View Postmpf1959, on 05 October 2019 - 04:15 PM, said:

Life is a two way street, or was it a bowl of cornflakes? Anyway, someone said it! 


A box of chocolate. It's all the same. But different. 



LCpl_Jones #10 Posted 05 October 2019 - 09:20 PM

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maybe it's because wg are crap at making maps

Bulldog_Drummond #11 Posted 05 October 2019 - 09:24 PM

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It breeds character

 

Image result for calvin It breeds character



LordMuffin #12 Posted 06 October 2019 - 08:58 AM

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View Postkiller999death, on 05 October 2019 - 03:24 PM, said:

 

Redshire, why does the South team get a sniping position on the hill towards North team's heavy tank route but North team does not get a sniping position on South's heavy tank route. South HTs can make it safely to the zeppelin brawling position while North's are F**ked by TD's always camping the circled hill. I lost 60+% HP in that battle even before I got onto the platform created by WG to give HT's a small battle arena (because that's what WG does in all maps, makes small battle arenas for HT's etc. which creates hideous maps).

 

 

 

 

Another map I find absolutely retardedly unfair is Himmelsdorf.

 

 

Why do you have to choke North team's acces to castle platform but give a safe passage to South team? Who at Wargaming said ''Hey this is fair to both teams'' When every damn battle players rush onto that platform and if one team gets choked it's over, it's fu**ed!

Same crapwith Mines, I had a topic on that one already with fixes for the hill etc. 


 

Redshire is like one of the best maps in game.

 

Yes, south can snipe the northern heavies going to that position. Buy there is lots of ways to counter it.

 

For example, you don't have to go there in your heavy tank.

Another idea is to see wether your light tanks can remove the enemy spotters so you can go there safely.

07:59 Added after 1 minute

View Post8126Jakobsson, on 05 October 2019 - 04:00 PM, said:

That's just how they roll. Maybe it's to ensure a victory for all kinds of players. Empires Border encounter might be worst of them all though. 

Mines Encounter wants to have a word inmost unbalanced map.

08:02 Added after 3 minute

View Postkiller999death, on 05 October 2019 - 04:08 PM, said:

 

I quite liked Stalingrad because heavy tanks had more cover and routes to use than let's say 1 big and 1 small rock arena and the medium lane had houses too with 2 different elevations. A lot of people hated Stalingrad but it was actually one of the more flexible maps out there and it's a bloody city map. Granted light tanks were screwed but could still do damage on distracted enemies or doing drive by's like it's a GTA mission.

 

Now WG makes 2 or 3 lane maps like it's League of Legends and places small arenas for HTs to fight on.  Studzianki is an example of a bad map, it looks like someone created it because he skipped his 20 minute break and didn't know what to do so he created it. Empire's border is also a bad mapas it has only 2 and a half lanes with a platform for the teams to clash on. 



Yeah but the train station is not as powerful as the castle platform has complete vision over the streets below and if you are like me you use the terrain + cracked wall to shoot anything down on the horizontal street. 

 

 

 

 

When they do they still need to drive out of the funnel and before you get to those houses it's still open ground. South has a much easier time getting out of it because once you drop into the water you can climb up the hill and usually spot all the TD's camping on hill. The only thing South has to worry is TD's camping where Waffle IV and Leopard are in my map. That's the only thing.

Stalingrad was such a nice map compared to many of the new ones or rebalanced ones.

 

WG just have to remove a few more road blocks to make it even better. 


Edited by flashmove_iron, 07 October 2019 - 09:45 AM.


8126Jakobsson #13 Posted 06 October 2019 - 09:21 AM

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View PostLordMuffin, on 06 October 2019 - 08:58 AM, said:

Mines Encounter wants to have a word inmost unbalanced map.

 

Empires Border is Mines with the cap on the hill and the hill even closer to north. You just go there and play whac-a-mole with anyone wanting to come up/in. They removed assault on it since it was broken, but encounter is basically the same since one team gets the cap hill for free. :D



Lycopersicon #14 Posted 06 October 2019 - 09:30 AM

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We either have to accept some imbalance, or get perfectly mirrored maps. It is, of course, arguable how big an imbalance is acceptable, but IMO some degree of it is far better than mirror maps, because the latter would effectively half the variability that the game offers.

Edited by Lycopersicon, 06 October 2019 - 09:33 AM.


Mimos_A #15 Posted 06 October 2019 - 12:51 PM

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View PostLycopersicon, on 06 October 2019 - 09:30 AM, said:

We either have to accept some imbalance, or get perfectly mirrored maps. It is, of course, arguable how big an imbalance is acceptable, but IMO some degree of it is far better than mirror maps, because the latter would effectively half the variability that the game offers.

 

Asymmetrical maps does not mean they have to be imbalanced. Just giving one spawn easier/quicker access to a key position on the map (mines, live oaks), or giving them crossfires that the enemy team cannot avoid (fjords) is bad map design. It's not a necessary consequence of asymmetrical maps, it's just incompetence.


Edited by Mimos_A, 06 October 2019 - 12:52 PM.


iuytr #16 Posted 06 October 2019 - 02:18 PM

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WG have removed maps that I really liked to play, even if they were a bit lopsided. That was actually part of the fun.

 

What puzzles me is that the argument for keeping winrate in random battles as part of the scoring, that it evens out over a number of battles, wasn't considered valid for keeping all those fun maps. 



Desyatnik_Pansy #17 Posted 06 October 2019 - 02:20 PM

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View Postkiller999death, on 05 October 2019 - 04:08 PM, said:

When they do they still need to drive out of the funnel and before you get to those houses it's still open ground. South has a much easier time getting out of it because once you drop into the water you can climb up the hill and usually spot all the TD's camping on hill. The only thing South has to worry is TD's camping where Waffle IV and Leopard are in my map. That's the only thing.

 

Might want to edit that post again, don't the mods get silly if you use red text?



PayMore #18 Posted 06 October 2019 - 02:24 PM

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Some CC's says WG dosnt care about these things. 

Mimos_A #19 Posted 06 October 2019 - 02:29 PM

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View Postiuytr, on 06 October 2019 - 02:18 PM, said:

WG have removed maps that I really liked to play, even if they were a bit lopsided. That was actually part of the fun.

 

What puzzles me is that the argument for keeping winrate in random battles as part of the scoring, that it evens out over a number of battles, wasn't considered valid for keeping all those fun maps. 


It's not part of the fun to know a game is pretty much lost from the start because you happened to spawn on the wrong side. It's a frustrating excersize in futility.



killer999death #20 Posted 06 October 2019 - 03:59 PM

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Another thing which I find stupid are locations which  have only 1 entry way such as Mines hill or that frozen map with the carrier and I'd probably find more if I'd care to think. Why create these locations? Why pressure people into rushing them and potentionally getting them killed right away? It's either rush and risk it or play safe and enemy gets a powerful location. It's D U M B! 




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