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so gold ammo was everyone's problem... result: let's nerf HE so we can't shoot the wheel...


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HassenderZerhacker #1 Posted 17 October 2019 - 09:24 PM

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hmmmm...

let me get this straight: everyone's problem was how GOLD AMMO negated armor and got spammed by every try hard. the result is that WG is now nerfing HE ammo and wants to completely remove HE penetrating shots... consequence: we won't be able to get even a *lucky* shot to destroy the mario karts, instead they will just eat a 150mm shell in the face and continue rolling while repairing that broken wheel...

 



Draqutsc #2 Posted 17 October 2019 - 09:27 PM

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You forgot that HE will ignore all armor, so a maus will receive the same HE damage as a paper tank.

So HE will always do damage, no matter what.

So it's a nerf to all armored tanks and a buff to the tanks without any armor.


Edited by Draqutsc, 17 October 2019 - 09:28 PM.


ziratulbihac #3 Posted 17 October 2019 - 09:44 PM

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View PostDraqutsc, on 17 October 2019 - 08:27 PM, said:

You forgot that HE will ignore all armor, so a maus will receive the same HE damage as a paper tank.

So HE will always do damage, no matter what.

So it's a nerf to all armored tanks and a buff to the tanks without any armor.

 

Why would MAUS take any dmg from HE?

 

Is WG gonna destroy the MOST BASIC logic that extremely armored tanks CAN NOT suffer damage from explosive? 

 

300 dmg to Maus from HE.. . HA HA HAHA



HassenderZerhacker #4 Posted 17 October 2019 - 09:57 PM

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View PostDraqutsc, on 17 October 2019 - 09:27 PM, said:

You forgot that HE will ignore all armor, so a maus will receive the same HE damage as a paper tank.

So HE will always do damage, no matter what.

So it's a nerf to all armored tanks and a buff to the tanks without any armor.

 

I didn't forget that... it's just the second part of the silly news.

there's silly part 1 and silly part 2...

let's hope this will get a big no in the tests



Element6 #5 Posted 17 October 2019 - 10:02 PM

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People shooting premium ammo really hasn't been a problem for me...

CmdRatScabies #6 Posted 17 October 2019 - 10:12 PM

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Maybe we'll get canister shells so we can shotgun the little buggers.

HassenderZerhacker #7 Posted 17 October 2019 - 10:20 PM

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View PostElement6, on 17 October 2019 - 10:02 PM, said:

People shooting premium ammo really hasn't been a problem for me...


if that change goes through, tomatoes shooting HE will be a problem.



ThorgrimBrenadim #8 Posted 18 October 2019 - 02:10 AM

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View PostCmdRatScabies, on 17 October 2019 - 10:12 PM, said:

Maybe we'll get canister shells so we can shotgun the little buggers.

 

Nah we will insist all mediums heavys and TD's get 3 drones each that will fly at upwards of 300mph turn on a six-pence and deal 600 plus damage on contact. 

 

( Did I add they are lazer guided and once you just think that is who you want to hit off they go and bye bye pesky wheelies............side benefit with 3 each we can also target those god awfull arty's in the same way ) :)


Edited by ThorgrimBrenadim, 18 October 2019 - 02:11 AM.


Element6 #9 Posted 18 October 2019 - 05:47 AM

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View PostHassenderZerhacker, on 17 October 2019 - 10:20 PM, said:


if that change goes through, tomatoes shooting HE will be a problem.

Would it only be a problem if tomatoes shoot HE but not if above average or better players do it? That sounds a bit condescending.

 

But if it becomes a real issue like some like to think, then I guess I can fire HE back at them.



undutchable80 #10 Posted 18 October 2019 - 06:51 AM

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View PostHassenderZerhacker, on 17 October 2019 - 09:24 PM, said:

hmmmm...

let me get this straight: everyone's problem was how GOLD AMMO negated armor and got spammed by every try hard. the result is that WG is now nerfing HE ammo and wants to completely remove HE penetrating shots... consequence: we won't be able to get even a *lucky* shot to destroy the mario karts, instead they will just eat a 150mm shell in the face and continue rolling while repairing that broken wheel...

 

Not entirely true. The problem is armour and the lack of weakspots pennable by standard ammo, which means ppl resort to premium ammo. 

 

And standard and premium ammo were rebalanced, its just that ppl seem to have forgotten about it:

Changes from previous Sandbox iterations (the revision of the standard shells and changes in the number of hit points for all vehicles in the game) worked well (https://worldoftanks.eu/en/news/general-news/sandbox-october/)

This means that the 2nd test they did many months ago was considered a succes by WG and will be implemented in a future update.

 

What this means is that all tanks (especially T1-6) will get an x% hp buff (already live on Sandbox), standard ammo does more dmg but keeps the same pen (also live on SB), premium ammo is unchanged (so basically a relative nerf, and also on the SB). This means that (super)heavy tanks with great armour, which still wont be pennable by standard ammo - no matter how high the dmg it can do, STILL require premium ammo to pen. But due to the hp buff, you will need to fire MORE to kill off said tank. 

 

And sure, ppl wil say: " flank" but we have all been in mid-late game situations or maps where that is nigh on impossible or inevitable that you will have to engage that tank at some point. 



Cobra6 #11 Posted 18 October 2019 - 08:06 AM

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Well, that is what WG is quite famous for. Tackling problems with more problems instead of solutions.

 

- Premium ammo is an issue but so is over-armoring of tanks, neither get tackled and only increase.

- Weakspots got removed so gold-ammo is now compulsory, especially in higher tiers.

- Arty has been a problem since the start of this game and after two major redesigns still is. Instead of removing it like all other games (and blitz), they keep trying to make it work.

- Premium ammo making armor obsolete in the early years of this game resulted in endless corridor map redesigns instead of addressing the actual problem: Gold-ammo.

- Bad players getting taken out by TD's and light tanks too frequently: Nerf TD camo, give light tanks horrible penetration drop-off and removing many good cover locations from all maps so front-lines become effectively deserts with 1-2 bushes scattered around.

 

Basically, doing anything but addressing the actual issue since the actual issue is deliberate on WG's part to make more money. Since premium ammo is compulsory people are psychologically pushed to buy premium accounts and tanks.

 

Cobra 6


Edited by Cobra6, 18 October 2019 - 08:08 AM.


SovietBias #12 Posted 18 October 2019 - 08:13 AM

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View PostDraqutsc, on 17 October 2019 - 08:27 PM, said:

You forgot that HE will ignore all armor, so a maus will receive the same HE damage as a paper tank.

So HE will always do damage, no matter what.

So it's a nerf to all armored tanks and a buff to the tanks without any armor.

 

No it won't. Go to the sandbox and try it or read the article. HE shells damage still gets negated by armor nominal thickness. 



tajj7 #13 Posted 18 October 2019 - 08:52 AM

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It would be helpful if people actually read the and understood what they are doing, trying to claim that this is a nerf to armour is just silly, overall HE is going to do a lot less damage, its just always going to do some damage, but for small calibre rounds against armoured targets that is going to be a very small amount.

 

Block Quote

 everyone's problem was how GOLD AMMO negated armo

 

No that was not my problem, I have never thought premium ammo was that big of an issue, most tanks can bounce a decent amount premium ammo if used correctly. 

 

High calibre HE has always IMO been a bypass through armour more than premium ammo, auto-aim/snap like a T49 derp at a Maus you'll do like 300-400 damage most of the time, auto-aim/snap HEAT at a Maus and you'll bounce a lot of shots.  Try penning an IS7 turret with HEAT and then see how much damage an E100 with HE does.

 

AND as Undutchable has said above, there is already a premium ammo change in place that is likely to happen, standard shell alpha and HPs are increasing, whilst premium ammo stays the same, meaning effectively the premium rounds have lower alpha for higher pen.

 

Finally why would you shoot HE at a WV? HE has slow shell velocity most of the time so is bad for aiming at fast moving targets and doesn't like spaced armour so would explode on wheels

 

 



Ceeb #14 Posted 18 October 2019 - 09:10 AM

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View Posttajj7, on 18 October 2019 - 07:52 AM, said:

 

 

Finally why would you shoot HE at a WV? HE has slow shell velocity most of the time so is bad for aiming at fast moving targets and doesn't like spaced armour so would explode on wheels

 

 

 

 

In my experience, shooting HE at the wheeled vehicles casues them more grief, hurts more when hit than regular ammo rather than critical hit after critical hit,  I can see where the OP is coming from here. The HE change benefits the wheeled vehicles quite significantly.

 

But I'm also a convert from hating WVs to adapting (thanks for the advice btw) to them in the game.  I personally wont have one (I personally dislike a class that has different physics) than the rest of the tanks in the game Which is my only gripe with them, but the change will also hurt the WVs, as the majority of the tools playing them spam HE like a MUTHA FUDGER



tajj7 #15 Posted 18 October 2019 - 09:16 AM

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View PostCeeb, on 18 October 2019 - 08:10 AM, said:

 

 

In my experience, shooting HE at the wheeled vehicles casues them more grief, hurts more when hit than regular ammo rather than critical hit after critical hit,  I can see where the OP is coming from here. The HE change benefits the wheeled vehicles quite significantly.

 

But I'm also a convert from hating WVs to adapting (thanks for the advice btw) to them in the game.  I personally wont have one (I personally dislike a class that has different physics) than the rest of the tanks in the game Which is my only gripe with them, but the change will also hurt the WVs, as the majority of the tools playing them spam HE like a MUTHA FUDGER

 

APCR all the way for me if the tank has it, same when using WVs I use the APCR rounds the most, not the HE because HE is just an RNG fest. 



Ceeb #16 Posted 18 October 2019 - 09:25 AM

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View Posttajj7, on 18 October 2019 - 08:16 AM, said:

 

APCR all the way for me if the tank has it, same when using WVs I use the APCR rounds the most, not the HE because HE is just an RNG fest. 

 

You are one person, I've never seen one fire AP



Gatix #17 Posted 18 October 2019 - 09:48 AM

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HE was best to finish low HP opponent or full hulldown IS-7, obj430U, Obj260 and so on..

 

HE no need nerf.



Dava_117 #18 Posted 18 October 2019 - 09:50 AM

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View Posttajj7, on 18 October 2019 - 08:52 AM, said:

Finally why would you shoot HE at a WV? HE has slow shell velocity most of the time so is bad for aiming at fast moving targets and doesn't like spaced armour so would explode on wheels

 

Most tanks HE have a flight speed close or identical to the AP round. In many tanks using HE at the WV is actually the smart move, as HE take off more than a wheel and, if hit and pen, deal more damage to WV.

 

And, to be fair, the only problematic HE are the 183 HESH and, before the nerf, Type5 derp.

They nerfed the P2W derp, so now the AP gun is better and fixing the 183 HESH is quite easy too, without changing the mechanics. That shell problem is the fact that, without a penetration, it does an amount of damage comparable to AP. With the HP and AP buff on SB the HESH is already fixed, as 800HP from a non penetration would have been a lot less than 1400 HP with an AP pen.

Everyone else using HE only is just wasting his DPM. Also weackspotless hulldown tanks deserves all the HE they got from high caliber guns.



Keller #19 Posted 18 October 2019 - 10:00 AM

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View PostDraqutsc, on 17 October 2019 - 09:27 PM, said:

You forgot that HE will ignore all armor, so a maus will receive the same HE damage as a paper tank.

So HE will always do damage, no matter what.

So it's a nerf to all armored tanks and a buff to the tanks without any armor.


yeah a maus was the problem…. everything can pen a maus in the front with gold. Quite a few do not even need gold.



PayMore #20 Posted 18 October 2019 - 12:01 PM

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View PostHassenderZerhacker, on 17 October 2019 - 08:24 PM, said:

hmmmm...

let me get this straight: everyone's problem was how GOLD AMMO negated armor and got spammed by every try hard. the result is that WG is now nerfing HE ammo and wants to completely remove HE penetrating shots... consequence: we won't be able to get even a *lucky* shot to destroy the mario karts, instead they will just eat a 150mm shell in the face and continue rolling while repairing that broken wheel...

 

 

Twitchplayers and top 5% clanplayers dont like HE and WG cater to them, so ofc WG nerf and keep gold solid. They have allrdy cried and gotten arty nerfs. 






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