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battle types Modes challenges skill

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Dead_in_30_seconds #1 Posted 03 November 2019 - 02:56 PM

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Greetings fellow tankers.

 

My topic today, is 'brand new battle type'.

 

What if there was a new type of battle type?

This new set-up would be this.

 

You select a battle type called 'Best of the Best'. You then choose which tier, then which class, LT, MT, HT, TD, SPG.

This then places you in a battle, where every participant gets the same tank, same configuration, same 100% crew. The tank config is set, you can't add to its spec, you can't change the load-out, you play EXACTLY the same tank as everyone else.

 

You can play a maximum of 10 battles of this new mode, per day.

 

At the end of every month, the top (3,5,10,50?) players in each tank class, get a reward, whatever that may be, but I suggest it should be reasonably substantial.

 

The point is this.

 

If everyone plays the SAME tank, the players with more SKILL are rewarded.

It's a leveller. No more clubbing, no more OP'd tanks, rewards are purely based on being a better player.

 

The benefits are obvious. Learn the mechanics, and you'll do better. Learn the strengths/weaknesses of the tank. Learn situational awareness and communication, you'll do better. Learn angling/scraping etc, you'll do better.

 

Now the knee-jerk detractors will point to the obvious. Some maps are better for some tank types than others, but the point is, you all face the same advantages/disadvantages, what matters is how YOU play compared to others.

 

The algorith for determining your score at the end of each battle, and I would leave that to those who's job it is to determine such things, would be up for deabte, but the current one for WN8 isn't a bad place to start.

Personally, I like the idea. How many times have you played a battle, killed 4, spotted loads, played a good game, but received little or no reward because your team-mates have melted like snow-flakes? This new mode would recognise your skill, not reward the stupid, and encourage players to invest in learning the basics.

 

And now the fun starts. What do you think? What are your thoughts on the principal behind my proposal?

Basically, do you believe in its intention?

 

Regards as ever

DiTS

 



Scanmen #2 Posted 03 November 2019 - 05:41 PM

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- Irony on -
So everyone will have an equal chance in battle and only player skills decides? Are you insane? :facepalm:
- Irony off -

 

Interesting idea, worth thinking about. I support it. :great:


Edited by Scanmen, 03 November 2019 - 05:41 PM.


splash_time #3 Posted 03 November 2019 - 07:31 PM

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View PostDead_in_30_seconds, on 03 November 2019 - 05:26 PM, said:

Greetings fellow tankers.

 

My topic today, is 'brand new battle type'.

 

What if there was a new type of battle type?

This new set-up would be this.

 

You select a battle type called 'Best of the Best'. You then choose which tier, then which class, LT, MT, HT, TD, SPG.

This then places you in a battle, where every participant gets the same tank, same configuration, same 100% crew. The tank config is set, you can't add to its spec, you can't change the load-out, you play EXACTLY the same tank as everyone else.

 

You can play a maximum of 10 battles of this new mode, per day.

 

At the end of every month, the top (3,5,10,50?) players in each tank class, get a reward, whatever that may be, but I suggest it should be reasonably substantial.

 

The point is this.

 

If everyone plays the SAME tank, the players with more SKILL are rewarded.

It's a leveller. No more clubbing, no more OP'd tanks, rewards are purely based on being a better player.

 

The benefits are obvious. Learn the mechanics, and you'll do better. Learn the strengths/weaknesses of the tank. Learn situational awareness and communication, you'll do better. Learn angling/scraping etc, you'll do better.

 

Now the knee-jerk detractors will point to the obvious. Some maps are better for some tank types than others, but the point is, you all face the same advantages/disadvantages, what matters is how YOU play compared to others.

 

The algorith for determining your score at the end of each battle, and I would leave that to those who's job it is to determine such things, would be up for deabte, but the current one for WN8 isn't a bad place to start.

Personally, I like the idea. How many times have you played a battle, killed 4, spotted loads, played a good game, but received little or no reward because your team-mates have melted like snow-flakes? This new mode would recognise your skill, not reward the stupid, and encourage players to invest in learning the basics.

 

And now the fun starts. What do you think? What are your thoughts on the principal behind my proposal?

Basically, do you believe in its intention?

 

Regards as ever

DiTS

 

 

Good idea overall, but the problem is, if any player didn't learn the basics after 50k-60k battles, then how you guarantee that this mode will help? 

And yes...the same players who play with that OP-ed tanks will become the top players, because they are experienced! :D

 

Good goal! But the game will remain the same. ;)


Edited by splash_time, 03 November 2019 - 07:32 PM.


OIias_of_Sunhillow #4 Posted 03 November 2019 - 10:41 PM

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View Postsplash_time, on 03 November 2019 - 06:31 PM, said:

 

Good idea overall, but the problem is, if any player didn't learn the basics after 50k-60k battles, then how you guarantee that this mode will help? 

 

Well, it'll take away from them blaming other, better, tanks, and they may look more inwardly as to where their problem lies.

 

 

View Postsplash_time, on 03 November 2019 - 06:31 PM, said:

And yes...the same players who play with that OP-ed tanks will become the top players, because they are experienced! 

 

But these people only do well against worse tanks than what they have. Usually.

 

I think it's an idea worth exploring at the very least. Pros and cons an' stuff...



Evilier_than_Skeletor #5 Posted 04 November 2019 - 12:22 AM

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Now that would make a fine event, if not a permanent game mode.

Orkbert #6 Posted 04 November 2019 - 12:34 AM

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View PostDead_in_30_seconds, on 03 November 2019 - 02:56 PM, said:

 

You select a battle type called 'Best of the Best'. You then choose which tier, then which class, LT, MT, HT, TD, SPG.

 

I don't think people enjoy much getting a random tank even if all players get the same. Especially with a pre-set loadout.

One of the troubles of the historical battles was that people didn't like not having the gun they liked on their tank and having no say in the ammo loadout, but at least they had their normal tank crew int heir vehicle Now in this mode they wouldn't even get to choose the tank (unless they choose tierIII HT in which case all would get the type 91, yay...)

 

And good luck getting enough people in the chosen type and tier wanting to play a match.

 

Also given the spotting mechanics of the game this mode will become very unwieldy. Who is gonna spot the opponent and how will the rewards be distributed? In an all Flakbus match everyone probably wants to snipe and with its lack of armor nobody will want to be the spotter. An AT2 match, even if all tanks lurch forward it will probably be several minutes before the first opponent gets spotted.



Gremlin182 #7 Posted 04 November 2019 - 11:03 AM

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I assume you mean if I pick the M4 sherman all the medium tanks will be M4 shermans not 15 shermans vs 15.

Because while it could work 15 spgs vs 15 spgs wouldnt be much fun.

 

Light Medium Heavy games would work fine

TDs also probably ok a lot of the time.

SPGs nope except for the LeFE thats a pretty decent TD



Miepie #8 Posted 04 November 2019 - 04:22 PM

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It would be hilarious to watch all those 15 tanks trying to cram themselves into one highly specific bush "because that's where this tank goes on this map in the current meta". :popcorn:

SiliconSidewinder #9 Posted 04 November 2019 - 07:58 PM

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Sounds good, I am in.

Dead_in_30_seconds #10 Posted 04 November 2019 - 09:09 PM

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Hey guys, thanks for taking the time to reply. :great:

 

Been considering this a little more.

 

Was thinking, how this would work?

Looked at:

'Player chooses tank and tier'? Problem is obvious, chances of getting 30 players choosing same combination, very slim, so ruled it out.

'Player chooses tank only, game chooses tier'? Same problem, though slightly less, so ruled that out.

'Player chooses tier, game chooses tank'? Hmmm, works better, might consider.

'Player chooses tank type, game chooses tank and tier'? Better, I like the sound of this one.

 

Also been thinking about the mechanics behind this, and let's just stick to LT, MT and HT, I came up with the following:

The 'Mode' has access to all tanks, all nations, all tiers. When a player chooses one of the 3 classes, the game finds 29 other players looking for the same, then selects a tank to play. As stated previously, it's the same tank, same config, same tier, same load-out for all players.

It then selects a map from a list that is suited to that particular tank class. Opinion will be divided on this, I'm sure.

 

When we consider something like this, one of the important questions is, what's in it for WG? And this is key. There has to be a reason why, else why bother?

The answer I came up with is this. There's a well worn and trusted business axiom that states, for any supplier of goods and/or services, 20% of your customers deliver 80% of your revenue. How this manifests itself in WoT is that there are literally tens of thousands of players who fall into the 'newbie' category.

They know the basics, they are maintaining reasonable Win Rates, but find themselves 'stuck' at T4 to T6. They are considering moving up the tiers, but are put off by the horror stories, or the grind required. These are your 80%ers.

Now, suddenly, they sometimes get to play a tier 10 without getting endlessly slaughtered by vastly superior, improved equipmented, 7 skill crews.

They play some higher tiers, and realise, although the game is tougher, that maybe they should move up.

These are the 80%, these are exactly the sources of increased revenue that WG would like to encourage. And what better way than to level the playing field? What better way than rewarding a players skill?

 

Talking of rewards, how does that work? Well I thought about that too. Now, this is hugely simplified, but the principal is clear. The algorithm's used to award a 'score', would be weighted depending on tank type.

 

For example, when playing LT's, the majority score would be for DMG and KILLS. You would get some score for SPOTTING, a little more for SPOTTING DMG, a bonus for FIRE FOR EFFECT, and a small(ish) multiplier for VICTORY.

For HT's, there would be a switch around. Now, the reward for SPOTTING and SPOTTING DMG, swaps places with DMG and KILLS. This would have the effect of reducing the amount of 'I'm camping, you go and spot, I'm not moving.'

For Mediums, you'd have to find a balance. Some are pretty mobile, whilst others not so. Possibly a 'flat rate' across the 4 elements? I'm not sure, we'd have to think about that one.

 

I appreciate, it needs a lot of thought to iron out the details, and I do appreciate your comments, but the more I think about this, the more I like it.

I do believe it will teach some things, tho' some can't/won't be taught, there will be some who dismiss this out of hand as nonsense, and yet more who will 'what if?' it to death, but the idea of a purely skill based test might just appeal.

 

Thanks once again for your time, consideration and comment.

Much appreciated

DiTS



Bordhaw #11 Posted 04 November 2019 - 09:11 PM

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View PostDead_in_30_seconds, on 03 November 2019 - 01:56 PM, said:

If everyone plays the SAME tank, the players with more SKILL are rewarded.

It's a leveller. No more clubbing, no more OP'd tanks, rewards are purely based on being a better player.

 

The benefits are obvious. Learn the mechanics, and you'll do better. Learn the strengths/weaknesses of the tank. Learn situational awareness and communication, you'll do better. Learn angling/scraping etc, you'll do better.

 

Basically, do you believe in its intention?

 

No because someone with 25,000 battles will still beat someone with 3,500 battles.

 

So what are you trying to achieve? 



Dead_in_30_seconds #12 Posted 04 November 2019 - 09:15 PM

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View PostBordhaw, on 04 November 2019 - 08:11 PM, said:

 

No because someone with 25,000 battles will still beat someone with 3,500 battles.

 

So what are you trying to achieve? 


Gittin gudder by learning from someone who I can observe driving the same tank as me. Beating me because of his choices, not because his tank has a Klingon cloaking device.

Surely the only way to improve is by playing better players?

 

View PostGremlin182, on 04 November 2019 - 10:03 AM, said:

I assume you mean if I pick the M4 sherman all the medium tanks will be M4 shermans not 15 shermans vs 15.

Because while it could work 15 spgs vs 15 spgs wouldnt be much fun.

 

Light Medium Heavy games would work fine

TDs also probably ok a lot of the time.

SPGs nope except for the LeFE thats a pretty decent TD

 

Not quite.

If you chose Medium, and it chose the M4 Sherman, everybody would be in the same tank. Same config, same load-out, same everything.

 

I can imagine a game like that. If someone on the red team stormed it, wouldn't it be useful to load up the replay, then observe what they did?

Free camera to their tank, then watch. How did they play? Where did they position? What did they do that was different to me? What can I learn from them?

 

I can only speak for me, and God knows I've a lot to learn, but that type of insight, that opportunity to see first hand the difference between my choices and theirs, well I believe you couldn't get that quality of tuition anywhere else.

 

 


 

WISE_MARKSMAN_5 #13 Posted 25 November 2019 - 04:45 PM

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Sounds interesting

Homer_J #14 Posted 25 November 2019 - 05:26 PM

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As a separate mode, fine, I would have no interest in it though.  Variety has always been one of the things which I liked about WoT.

 

I'm not sure it will work for SPG though, 15 players saying "you go spot".



Silverwarg #15 Posted 25 November 2019 - 06:51 PM

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View PostDead_in_30_seconds, on 04 November 2019 - 08:15 PM, said:


Gittin gudder by learning from someone who I can observe driving the same tank as me. Beating me because of his choices, not because his tank has a Klingon cloaking device.

Surely the only way to improve is by playing better players?

 

 

Not quite.

If you chose Medium, and it chose the M4 Sherman, everybody would be in the same tank. Same config, same load-out, same everything.

 

I can imagine a game like that. If someone on the red team stormed it, wouldn't it be useful to load up the replay, then observe what they did?

Free camera to their tank, then watch. How did they play? Where did they position? What did they do that was different to me? What can I learn from them?

 

I can only speak for me, and God knows I've a lot to learn, but that type of insight, that opportunity to see first hand the difference between my choices and theirs, well I believe you couldn't get that quality of tuition anywhere else.

 

 


 

 

You're forgetting one very important aspect, what you learn from it, except possibly from angling, would not be very applicable in normal random battles, because these battles would not evolve as a random battle does.

 

Back in the days there was a test with nation vs nation mode which several times devolved into 15 Hellcats vs 15 Cromwells, and these battles were insanely campy because 90% of the teams went to the same position, one peeked up, got shot to hell and everyone got the message and just kept their heads down for the next 10 min, except for the people with Alzheimer who forgot that the burning wreckage was their former teammate and decided to check if the enemy team had really loaded into the battle.

 

Edit: Besides, why not just have the pre-set tanks instead? Because if you start calculating how many different variations of games that has to exist, based on all available setups, we're talking billions of ques.


Edited by Silverwarg, 25 November 2019 - 06:53 PM.


TheJumpMaster #16 Posted 01 December 2019 - 12:44 AM

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This is a very interesting idea, but it should be in the Suggestions thread and not the new comers' thread (none of the participants are new comers).

 

WoT Suggestion thread

 

 

Cheers,

Jumpy







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