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Extremely low win rate on Pershing

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sammygo #1 Posted 19 November 2019 - 08:44 PM

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Sure, I'm a below average player. Overall WR 46-47%. But after 163 games I have arrived at a win rate of 35% (!) in this horrible tank. I know this tank supposed to be buffed. But 35%? And I'm actually trying to win :). Am I just extremely bad in this tank, or perhaps also a little bit unlucky? I have a much more average WR in other T8 tanks I play. Are there other players who really suck in this tank?

samuelx43a #2 Posted 19 November 2019 - 09:21 PM

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View Postsammygo, on 19 November 2019 - 08:44 PM, said:

Sure, I'm a below average player. Overall WR 46-47%. But after 163 games I have arrived at a win rate of 35% (!) in this horrible tank. I know this tank supposed to be buffed. But 35%? And I'm actually trying to win :). Am I just extremely bad in this tank, or perhaps also a little bit unlucky? I have a much more average WR in other T8 tanks I play. Are there other players who really suck in this tank?

I don't want to be that guy...

 

But it has to do with skill and experience. 8 thousand games may sound like a lot but here, its not much. The pershing while it can do the job, it is in the lower end for the tier VIII meds, and the only thing preventing it being rock bottom is that it has -10 gundep and has 400m view range.

 

And believe me, I was in the same position and in some cases even worse when I had 10k battles.

Good luck on the grind(I'm warning you that the m45 patton guide is some of the worst in the game, on par with the wz-120 grind)

 

speaking of bad winrates, have a look at my SU-122-44s, its hilariously bad


Edited by samuelx43a, 19 November 2019 - 09:47 PM.


Cigz #3 Posted 19 November 2019 - 09:27 PM

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Lets put it this way...for someone to have 60% winrate, another player must have 40%. It does not mean the 40% player is a bad player, just means simple mathematics dictates that there must be a balance within the 0-100% range. 

To your point, I think most of us have tanks with a low wr....I dont really know why this is, given the above maths example. Ive played 5 games in my E50M and have won 1 of them. On the other hand, Ive played 5 games in other tanks and have an 80 or 100% win rate in them. 

Personally, Ive gone from a 52% wr to a 49.9% wr in a matter of a few weeks....consistently ending up in crapmm where enemy team gets 5 unicums and my team gets none. Leading to evenings with 25 games played and 4-5 games won. This happens consistently. 

I play worse in such working circumstances (as I suspect most of us do) since you dont get to work properly, hence the losses come...and its just a downward spiral.

It sucks all the fun out of playing, one would have hoped the mm would do a better job, but it doesnt. 

In such poor working conditions, you seldom get to play to your max....its just not possible. 

so, I wouldnt feel too bad if you got a tank or 2 with poor winrate...Im sure you got some others with a good winrate :)

 



gunslingerXXX #4 Posted 19 November 2019 - 09:38 PM

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Its just your unlucky tank. I have the BC 25ap with 264 battles and a 36% winrate. 

The T32 I played long ago as my first tier 8, I even worse back then but somehow I got to 57% winrate over 245 battles. Both have similar WN8 yet there is 20% WR difference....



WindSplitter1 #5 Posted 19 November 2019 - 10:42 PM

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View PostgunslingerXXX, on 19 November 2019 - 08:38 PM, said:

Its just your unlucky tank. I have the BC 25ap with 264 battles and a 36% winrate. 

The T32 I played long ago as my first tier 8, I even worse back then but somehow I got to 57% winrate over 245 battles. Both have similar WN8 yet there is 20% WR difference....


B-C 25AP isn't your unlucky tank.

 

It's sh**e.



Stevies_Team #6 Posted 19 November 2019 - 10:45 PM

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It's an American tank, it's not meant to win

 

Capitalist pig tanks are cannon fodder for glorious soviet war machines

Have a nice day comrade



Wintermute_1 #7 Posted 19 November 2019 - 10:47 PM

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Panther II I just ground through in 107 games with a 42% WR, it's not the greatest tank in the world but it only takes one streak of crappy results to screw up a WR in a sample size of 100 - 200 games.  

Inappropriate_noob #8 Posted 19 November 2019 - 11:29 PM

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Is that the Pershing or the Super Pershing,either why I cannot make it work either.

sammygo #9 Posted 19 November 2019 - 11:42 PM

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Thanks for the comments. I feel a little bit less demotivated. Indeed, probably most of us have one or two crappy tanks which just doesn't fit our play style.

Stevies_Team #10 Posted 20 November 2019 - 12:21 AM

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View PostInappropriate_noob, on 19 November 2019 - 11:29 PM, said:

Is that the Pershing or the Super Pershing,either why I cannot make it work either.


Superpershing T26E4 is a pref MM monster skooby

 

BIA vents goggles rammer 6thsense recon armourer snapshot situational smoothride and camo

 

Avoid brawling, you have to jiggle about too much, medium to long range makes weakspots hard to hit

Arms length combat and farm damage while you bounce and peek spot

 

No Tier 10 megatanks make life a doddle

23:25 Added after 3 minute

View Postsammygo, on 19 November 2019 - 11:42 PM, said:

Thanks for the comments. I feel a little bit less demotivated. Indeed, probably most of us have one or two crappy tanks which just doesn't fit our play style.


Some tanks just seem to get the absolute worst MM teams and maps possible

My AMX CDA105 is a bogey tank

 

...doing ok so far... hang on a minit... where's my team gone... OMG its 3-11


Edited by Stevies_Team, 20 November 2019 - 12:25 AM.


Inappropriate_noob #11 Posted 20 November 2019 - 01:04 AM

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View PostCigz, on 19 November 2019 - 09:27 PM, said:

Lets put it this way...for someone to have 60% winrate, another player must have 40%. It does not mean the 40% player is a bad player, just means simple mathematics dictates that there must be a balance within the 0-100% range. 

To your point, I think most of us have tanks with a low wr....I dont really know why this is, given the above maths example. Ive played 5 games in my E50M and have won 1 of them. On the other hand, Ive played 5 games in other tanks and have an 80 or 100% win rate in them. 

Personally, Ive gone from a 52% wr to a 49.9% wr in a matter of a few weeks....consistently ending up in crapmm where enemy team gets 5 unicums and my team gets none. Leading to evenings with 25 games played and 4-5 games won. This happens consistently. 

I play worse in such working circumstances (as I suspect most of us do) since you dont get to work properly, hence the losses come...and its just a downward spiral.

It sucks all the fun out of playing, one would have hoped the mm would do a better job, but it doesnt. 

In such poor working conditions, you seldom get to play to your max....its just not possible. 

so, I wouldnt feel too bad if you got a tank or 2 with poor winrate...Im sure you got some others with a good winrate :)

 

That is a great post,sort of gives meaning as to why me and my alt are here,it is just to make the good players better,now it has all come together:D

00:07 Added after 2 minute

View PostStevies_Team, on 20 November 2019 - 12:21 AM, said:


Superpershing T26E4 is a pref MM monster skooby

 

BIA vents goggles rammer 6thsense recon armourer snapshot situational smoothride and camo

 

Avoid brawling, you have to jiggle about too much, medium to long range makes weakspots hard to hit

Arms length combat and farm damage while you bounce and peek spot

 

No Tier 10 megatanks make life a doddle

23:25 Added after 3 minute


Some tanks just seem to get the absolute worst MM teams and maps possible

My AMX CDA105 is a bogey tank

 

...doing ok so far... hang on a minit... where's my team gone... OMG its 3-11

I think I need a guiding hand then (keep it clean) anytime you want to toon with tomato and to look good,give us a shout, lol



HassenderZerhacker #12 Posted 20 November 2019 - 02:31 AM

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I ground through the Pershing in 115 battles and immediately sold it.

It's a support tank, it doesn't carry matches.

I have decent stats in it, I played it as little like the Tiger I, i.e. using cover, hills and gun depression. And I also used lots of gold ammo.

 

I'm convinced there are "unlucky" tanks in every account. I can't make the IS-7 work for example. 35% WR.



undutchable80 #13 Posted 20 November 2019 - 08:21 AM

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View Postsammygo, on 19 November 2019 - 11:42 PM, said:

Thanks for the comments. I feel a little bit less demotivated. Indeed, probably most of us have one or two crappy tanks which just doesn't fit our play style.

Indeed, playing different classes and nations you will encounter lines, classes, tanks that just doesnt suit your style.

 

Personally, I hated the Pershing with a passion. After a few randoms games I played it in Frontline only, since the gun depression, VR and guarenteed battles vs only T8s made it a much less frustrating grind. The M46 (with the top gun) is my best performing T9 tank, so go figure. Hang in there!



3W1T4NK_ll_KN4T1W3 #14 Posted 20 November 2019 - 09:17 AM

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73.53% wr after 68 battles on my pershing, maybe u are just bad :mellow:

TungstenHitman #15 Posted 20 November 2019 - 09:44 AM

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View PostCigz, on 19 November 2019 - 08:27 PM, said:

Lets put it this way...for someone to have 60% winrate, another player must have 40%. 

 

 

That's not how it works. It isn't the same teams against the same teams. One player can win 9 out of 10 battles it doesn't mean another has only won 1 out of 10. The only way for that to happen would be if it was just the same player against the same player every battle, but it's not. 



Jauhesammutin #16 Posted 20 November 2019 - 09:53 AM

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View PostgunslingerXXX, on 19 November 2019 - 08:38 PM, said:

Its just your unlucky tank. I have the BC 25ap with 264 battles and a 36% winrate. 

The T32 I played long ago as my first tier 8, I even worse back then but somehow I got to 57% winrate over 245 battles. Both have similar WN8 yet there is 20% WR difference....

You can't directly compare WN8 of different tank types and tiers. Each tank has their own expected values for WN8 (mostly damage). Even same tier and same type tanks get different WN8 values.

 

My stats for:

 

AMX 13 57

2073 DPG, winrate 72,55%, 4,04 spots, 2,36 kills, 1499 XP and 5931 WN8

 

Type 62

 1926 DPG, winrate 68,87%, 3,49 spots, 2,07 kills, 1355 XP and 7663 WN8

 

Both are T7 premium light tanks. All the stats are better on AXM yet it has almost 2k less WN8 than the Type. 



pecopad #17 Posted 20 November 2019 - 09:56 AM

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Some tanks just have terrible MM... I also think they change it from time to time, because sometimes tanks that had bad MM start winning and just the vice versa..
09:01 Added after 5 minute

View PostJauhesammutin, on 20 November 2019 - 09:53 AM, said:

You can't directly compare WN8 of different tank types and tiers. Each tank has their own expected values for WN8 (mostly damage). Even same tier and same type tanks get different WN8 values.

 

My stats for:

 

AMX 13 57

2073 DPG, winrate 72,55%, 4,04 spots, 2,36 kills, 1499 XP and 5931 WN8

 

Type 62

 1926 DPG, winrate 68,87%, 3,49 spots, 2,07 kills, 1355 XP and 7663 WN8

 

Both are T7 premium light tanks. All the stats are better on AXM yet it has almost 2k less WN8 than the Type. 

 

I think there can be a correlation between skill and WR until you hit your skill ceiling. After you hit the skill ceiling is more up to the team you are than you.

 

I only can carry games up to tier V, where I indeed can win games just by myself many times. In higher tiers there is no correlation on how good or bad I am in the tank and the %WR, which is determined then by team composition.

 

To me is quite evident that MM is influenced by the tank you are in. Some tanks you don't even have to do anything and you win, others you can have a good game but you end up almost always in the losing team.


Edited by pecopad, 20 November 2019 - 10:02 AM.


TungstenHitman #18 Posted 20 November 2019 - 10:04 AM

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@Op. 35% win rate is definitely unlucky no matter how weak a player may be and that can happen with some tanks. There's another 14 players on the team so just one weak player isn't really going to tilt a large number of battles into losses.

 

That being true, you certainly could have improved that win rate to much healthier figure through your own personal input. Here's how it reads.

 

Average damage vs hp pool equals your battle input. So its 600 - 1440 = -840 

 

This is the figure that stats don't show. Now, you might be doing some spotting assist to reduce that negative figure but basically every time you play your Pershing your teammates have to deal 840 damage to the enemy team just to get even parity... before your team even starts to try and win, they have to find an extra 840 damage to compensate for your loss of hp vs the damage you have dealt.

 

So work on dealing at least around 1440 combined damage for a start. When you do that, at least you can say you have covered yourself. Then after that, look to deal more damage, and pick off tanks that are almost dead too. A dead tank is a gun removed from the battle. In this game, a tank with 1 hp will function just as strongly as a tank with full hp, so get him out of there asap. It's a numbers game at the end of the day, so try to make positive numbers in both damage and kills, which in turn is negative numbers for the enemy team. This, eventually translates into wins. 



RamRaid90 #19 Posted 20 November 2019 - 10:09 AM

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View PostCigz, on 19 November 2019 - 08:27 PM, said:

Lets put it this way...for someone to have 60% winrate, another player must have 40%. It does not mean the 40% player is a bad player, just means simple mathematics

 

 

No, that isn't how it works at all.



pecopad #20 Posted 20 November 2019 - 10:12 AM

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View PostRamRaid90, on 20 November 2019 - 10:09 AM, said:

 

No, that isn't how it works at all.

Apart from Draws, yes it is.

 

And what is more curious is that players who left the game have in average better WR than the ones who stay.







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