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obj 279 is the new T22


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sgtYester #1 Posted 23 November 2019 - 01:56 PM

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it is stupid op. Like the T22

 

nerf it or give it good weakspots!



RamRaid90 #2 Posted 23 November 2019 - 02:05 PM

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Well this is new.

And what do you propose we do with the people who worked their asses off to get it?

 

See, the big difference between the two tanks is that the majority of peple rigged missions to gain the T-22. Hence nerfing it wasn't that difficult since it was rarely won fairly.

The 279e is ligitimately owned by most that are good enough to have it (obviously there are some exceptions but that's not for me to say) Nerfing it now negates the hard work that most have done to own it, and completely devalues the achievement.

 

Personally as I play exclusively tier VIII+ and mostly IX and X, I don't see enough of them to cause major problems. So I can't see why it needs any major changes.

 

The 279e is very strong, there's no denying that. But the missions (especially the latter stages) specifically require skill to complete, utter noobs are not going to accidentally stumble accross it as they can with the 260.

 

So the guys you see driving them are likely to smash you regardless of the tank they're driving.


Edited by RamRaid90, 23 November 2019 - 02:12 PM.


mtnm #3 Posted 23 November 2019 - 02:15 PM

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The top 1000 players should get laser guns IMHO since they wouldn't impact the game that much /s.

RamRaid90 #4 Posted 23 November 2019 - 02:18 PM

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View Postmtnm, on 23 November 2019 - 01:15 PM, said:

The top 1000 players should get laser guns IMHO since they wouldn't impact the game that much /s.

 

The top 1000 players will hit you more often regardless of the gun you give them. There are more important factors in this game than merely "aiming the right direction"

 

Hence the reason good players have higher hit rates, and much more important a higher penetration ratio.



Dava_117 #5 Posted 23 November 2019 - 02:35 PM

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View PostRamRaid90, on 23 November 2019 - 02:05 PM, said:

Well this is new.

And what do you propose we do with the people who worked their asses off to get it?

 

See, the big difference between the two tanks is that the majority of peple rigged missions to gain the T-22. Hence nerfing it wasn't that difficult since it was rarely won fairly.

The 279e is ligitimately owned by most that are good enough to have it (obviously there are some exceptions but that's not for me to say) Nerfing it now negates the hard work that most have done to own it, and completely devalues the achievement.

 

Personally as I play exclusively tier VIII+ and mostly IX and X, I don't see enough of them to cause major problems. So I can't see why it needs any major changes.

 

The 279e is very strong, there's no denying that. But the missions (especially the latter stages) specifically require skill to complete, utter noobs are not going to accidentally stumble accross it as they can with the 260.

 

So the guys you see driving them are likely to smash you regardless of the tank they're driving.

 

The fact that is hard to get is not an excuse to make it OP.



Nitro_Tank #6 Posted 23 November 2019 - 02:47 PM

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Every tank should be in an at least okayish balanced state. Perfect balance can't be achieved, some will always be stronger than others.

 

But the degree to which some tanks trump others is completely mindblowing. The 279e is beyond busted.

 

Ofc if you are a total newbie, you will still be bad with the 279, no doubt about that. But the fact that good players can completely run away with a game just because they have a certain tank that only they can own, is just stupid.

 

"Hard to achieve" is in no way shape or farm an argument in favor of terrible tank balance. Nerf this tank not into the ground but to a place where it can properly compete without breaking the game.

 

Having a tank, that is hard to achieve, IS the achievement, not all of a sudden receiving a big boost. Let the people be in awe that you had the willpower and skill to get it, not make them angry that their game is being ruined.



breeeze #7 Posted 23 November 2019 - 02:59 PM

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View PostRamRaid90, on 23 November 2019 - 02:05 PM, said:

So the guys you see driving them are likely to smash you regardless of the tank they're driving.

 

 

The problem will come when WG keeps nerfing down the missions so more people get it



Balc0ra #8 Posted 23 November 2019 - 03:06 PM

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View PostRamRaid90, on 23 November 2019 - 02:05 PM, said:

And what do you propose we do with the people who worked their asses off to get it?

 

Unlike premiums. Reward tanks are not protected, and will be buffed/nerfed as needed.

 

T-22 was brokenly OP. And the majority rigged the games to get it. As more than half the games I played had some rigging on it. So both good and bad players got them, and still had 48% get a 60% WR in it easy. Thus it did not take long for it to get smacked.

 

279 has come gradually. And most have never seen more than one to know how to deal with them yet. And will get rolled over by it. And most of the early population on it were mostly unicorn players for WG to get any solid stat on what to nerf yet I suspect. Population on it is still below 4K it seems. And yes the server WR is still 5% higher than the Chieftain. And yes it's ridiculously strong even if you know where to aim on it. But I don't see WG doing anything to it for a while yet tbh.



RamRaid90 #9 Posted 23 November 2019 - 03:07 PM

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View PostDava_117, on 23 November 2019 - 01:35 PM, said:

 

The fact that is hard to get is not an excuse to make it OP.

 

Absolutely,  It's certainly strong, as any tank that requires that much effort should be. And i've nothing against anyone playing it.

 

But there is not a diverse enough playerbase, nor a big enough one, to say that it's OP. Any data collected on the tank is massively skewed. So saying it's overpowered is an overstatement


Edited by RamRaid90, 23 November 2019 - 03:11 PM.


Immensive #10 Posted 23 November 2019 - 03:15 PM

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The problem is, that its pretty hard to find a balance between keeping 279 rewarding and useful at the same time. Imagine Type5 having 240mm frontal armor instead of 260. It would just get useless.

 

Maybe one idea would be to nerf the 185mm part of the upper armorplate down to 230mm effective armor that most T9 and some T8 Tanks can pen it frontally.

Spoiler

 


Edited by Immensive, 23 November 2019 - 03:16 PM.


RamRaid90 #11 Posted 23 November 2019 - 03:16 PM

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View PostBalc0ra, on 23 November 2019 - 02:06 PM, said:

 

Unlike premiums. Reward tanks are not protected, and will be buffed/nerfed as needed.

 

T-22 was brokenly OP. And the majority rigged the games to get it. As more than half the games I played had some rigging on it. So both good and bad players got them, and still had 48% get a 60% WR in it easy. Thus it did not take long for it to get smacked.

 

279 has come gradually. And most have never seen more than one to know how to deal with them yet. And will get rolled over by it. And most of the early population on it were mostly unicorn players for WG to get any solid stat on what to nerf yet I suspect. Population on it is still below 4K it seems. And yes the server WR is still 5% higher than the Chieftain. And yes it's ridiculously strong even if you know where to aim on it. But I don't see WG doing anything to it for a while yet tbh.

 

The amount of them i've actually met where i've had no other choice but to fight it is at best miniscule. Playing mostly tier IX and X for the past few weeks I can count on my fingers the amount of them i've seen and I could use my thumbs to show you the amount i've had no other choice but to face down, even if I had one arm.

 

It's not that the tank isn't strong, but the population of them is so small that they cause very little balance problems in tier X.

 

Arty, 183mm guns, oversaturation of TDs are just a few of the problems tier X faces which are far more important than a tank you see once in a blue moon.

14:17 Added after 1 minute

View PostImmensive, on 23 November 2019 - 02:15 PM, said:

The problem is, that its pretty hard to find a balance between keeping 279 rewarding and useful at the same time. Imagine Type5 having 240mm frontal armor instead of 260. It would just get useless.

 

Maybe one idea would be to nerf the 185mm part of the upper armorplate down to 230mm effective armor that most T9 and some T8 Tanks can pen it frontally.

Spoiler

 

 

At close range the cupolas are easy to hit, I've had no problems when i've faced them with hitting or penning them. As  i've said, the  tank isn't around in enough battles to even cause a problem to most players.

 

And why should a tier X reward tank be able to get penned by tier VIII tanks which it will rarely see in thre current MM anyway?

 

That's how we get to the problems we have in game already. Tanks being balanced outside of their own tiers.

 

And besides that if you're trying to face a tank two tiers higher head on and expecting to win....


Edited by RamRaid90, 23 November 2019 - 03:22 PM.


G01ngToxicCommand0 #12 Posted 23 November 2019 - 03:25 PM

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View PostsgtYester, on 23 November 2019 - 01:56 PM, said:

it is stupid op. Like the T22

 

nerf it or give it good weakspots!


Why did you expect cyka blyat soviet masterrace Bobjects to not be stupidly OP?:amazed:



MrBinkles #13 Posted 23 November 2019 - 03:30 PM

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View PostRamRaid90, on 23 November 2019 - 02:16 PM, said:

 

The amount of them i've actually met where i've had no other choice but to fight it is at best miniscule. Playing mostly tier IX and X for the past few weeks I can count on my fingers the amount of them i've seen and I could use my thumbs to show you the amount i've had no other choice but to face down, even if I had one arm.

 

It's not that the tank isn't strong, but the population of them is so small that they cause very little balance problems in tier X.

 

Arty, 183mm guns, oversaturation of TDs are just a few of the problems tier X faces which are far more important than a tank you see once in a blue moon.

14:17 Added after 1 minute

 

At close range the cupolas are easy to hit, I've had no problems when i've faced them with hitting or penning them. As  i've said, the  tank isn't around in enough battles to even cause a problem to most players.

 

And why should a tier X reward tank be able to get penned by tier VIII tanks which it will rarely see in thre current MM anyway?

 

That's how we get to the problems we have in game already. Tanks being balanced outside of their own tiers.

 

And besides that if you're trying to face a tank two tiers higher head on and expecting to win....

Since when has WG ever prioritized fixes....because we needed crew skins before the ammo rework, or anything else for that matter.



Immensive #14 Posted 23 November 2019 - 03:38 PM

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View PostRamRaid90, on 23 November 2019 - 03:16 PM, said:

At close range the cupolas are easy to hit, I've had no problems when i've faced them with hitting or penning them. As  i've said, the  tank isn't around in enough battles to even cause a problem to most players.

 

And why should a tier X reward tank be able to get penned by tier VIII tanks which it will rarely see in thre current MM anyway?

 

That's how we get to the problems we have in game already. Tanks being balanced outside of their own tiers.

The situations where 279 is getting traded down by some cupola shootout is a rare situation that happens in just 20% of all 279 games. Played 770+ Games in 279 myself. So I know what situations can occur.

 

I can tell you that most times you can just drive straight over any T8 and T9 Tank. Thats why some players are able to get 70% - 76% Winrate without platooning.

The problem starts when you meet experienced players. They know about the armorlayout and so they start shooting heat at you. The armor effectiveness decreases tremendous.

 

Also stating that T10 reward tanks should not get penned by T8 Tanks is just wrong. One day there will be much more players having 279 then today (atm wot-life.com says 10k on eu). I wouldn´t count rarity as a balance factor, more like a delay for a problem that will get bigger.


Edited by Immensive, 23 November 2019 - 03:41 PM.


DownToMyLastUwU #15 Posted 23 November 2019 - 03:56 PM

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View PostRamRaid90, on 23 November 2019 - 02:07 PM, said:

 

Absolutely,  It's certainly strong, as any tank that requires that much effort should be. And i've nothing against anyone playing it.

 

But there is not a diverse enough playerbase, nor a big enough one, to say that it's OP. Any data collected on the tank is massively skewed. So saying it's overpowered is an overstatement

Just because not everyone has the 279(e) and it's not seen as much as a T110E3 for example doesn't mean that it should stay at it's unbalanced state in which it is right now.



jabster #16 Posted 23 November 2019 - 04:05 PM

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View PostRamRaid90, on 23 November 2019 - 01:05 PM, said:

Well this is new.

And what do you propose we do with the people who worked their asses off to get it?

 

See, the big difference between the two tanks is that the majority of peple rigged missions to gain the T-22. Hence nerfing it wasn't that difficult since it was rarely won fairly.

The 279e is ligitimately owned by most that are good enough to have it (obviously there are some exceptions but that's not for me to say) Nerfing it now negates the hard work that most have done to own it, and completely devalues the achievement.

 

Personally as I play exclusively tier VIII+ and mostly IX and X, I don't see enough of them to cause major problems. So I can't see why it needs any major changes.

 

The 279e is very strong, there's no denying that. But the missions (especially the latter stages) specifically require skill to complete, utter noobs are not going to accidentally stumble accross it as they can with the 260.

 

So the guys you see driving them are likely to smash you regardless of the tank they're driving.


So if good players had to work their asses of to get +5% to their RNG would you think that’s ok?



wEight_Tanker #17 Posted 23 November 2019 - 04:05 PM

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I don't know man. I can pen that thing frontally with regular ammo with ease in my IS-7, though 50-50%. Still, if you aim a bit at the left where the ammorack is, you might get a bonus satisfaction. :great:

barison1 #18 Posted 23 November 2019 - 04:23 PM

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View PostwEight_Tanker, on 23 November 2019 - 04:05 PM, said:

I don't know man. I can pen that thing frontally with regular ammo with ease in my IS-7, though 50-50%. Still, if you aim a bit at the left where the ammorack is, you might get a bonus satisfaction. :great:


pretty sure you are mixing up the front with the rear, try using glasses



wEight_Tanker #19 Posted 23 November 2019 - 04:26 PM

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View Postbarison1, on 23 November 2019 - 04:23 PM, said:


pretty sure you are mixing up the front with the rear, try using glasses

http://wotreplays.eu...ght_tanker-is-7

 

Honestly, quit the childish act and leave other peoples' threads out of this. If your goal is to make me mad, then use DMs which I will still ignore. :teethhappy:



barison1 #20 Posted 23 November 2019 - 04:28 PM

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View PostwEight_Tanker, on 23 November 2019 - 04:26 PM, said:

http://wotreplays.eu...ght_tanker-is-7

 

Honestly, quit the childish act and leave other peoples' threads out of this. If your goal is to make me mad, then use DMs which I will still ignore. :teethhappy:


total 279e front is about 300mm effective on flat ground, you cant pen that with is7 AP, even with APCR you have like a 40% chance at most when shooting dead middle

 

things change when shooting utter down on it, only then having a chance

 

https://tanks.gg/tank/obj-279-e/model?cs=is-7&vm=live

https://tanks.gg/tank/obj-279-e/model?cs=is-7&vm=live&cl=000001


Edited by barison1, 23 November 2019 - 04:36 PM.





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