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Just unlocked the Type 4 heavy


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Calmb4 #1 Posted 29 November 2019 - 12:35 PM

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How do you play this thing, everything pens me and I'm aware of it's weak points. I honestly think other players see me and go 'yummy'. I tried staying hull down at the back but with such a god awful DPM with the stock gun (400 alpha, 15 sec reload) the KV-1 is better at tier 5, its a joke surely?

 

So here's my question: How do you grind this awful tank?



Spurtung #2 Posted 29 November 2019 - 12:41 PM

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Tank isn't that awful, but the hard reality is that you probably aren't ready for that tier just yet.

Calmb4 #3 Posted 29 November 2019 - 12:42 PM

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This is my thirteenth tier 9 dood

Spurtung #4 Posted 29 November 2019 - 01:03 PM

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View PostCalmb4, on 29 November 2019 - 11:42 AM, said:

This is my thirteenth tier 9 dood

 

And you have 3 tier 10s too, yes, I can see it too, but that does not refute anything I've said, though.

Unless, that is,  you feel like you're getting great results at higher tiers. In which case, you be you.



Calmb4 #5 Posted 29 November 2019 - 01:10 PM

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View PostSpurtung, on 29 November 2019 - 01:03 PM, said:

 

And you have 3 tier 10s too, yes, I can see it too, but that does not refute anything I've said, though.

Unless, that is,  you feel like you're getting great results at higher tiers. In which case, you be you.

TBH man I do better with fast tanks and flanking, my mate plays the super heavies, so I have a couple. I mostly play LT, MT's and TD's. Usually when I hit tier 8/9 I start a new line so they dont get played alot. But if you think the Type 4 is a good tank you'll need to explain yourself. No mobility, cant flex, low pen with stock gun, stars need to align to have a good match, no arty, few high level TD's, no gold ammo lol. Has the HP to trade well but at 15 sec reload pffft not going to being putting out much damage. Its a preemptive tank, and that's half the problem, I know where I want to go but getting there without losing half my health is significant.

i get it you've 75k games under ur belt, to you I'm a noob but i stand firm Type4 in most matches is trash, it requires alot of luck in the matchmaker to have a good game. 

12:14 Added after 3 minute
Perhaps though you haven't noticed the power creep since you played the Type 4 (I'm guessing you have a type 5), when I'm in my TD's I love seeing the Type 4, it's breakfast :D

Edited by Calmb4, 29 November 2019 - 01:12 PM.


TungstenHitman #6 Posted 29 November 2019 - 01:15 PM

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View PostCalmb4, on 29 November 2019 - 11:35 AM, said:

How do you play this thing, everything pens me and I'm aware of it's weak points. I honestly think other players see me and go 'yummy'. I tried staying hull down at the back but with such a god awful DPM with the stock gun (400 alpha, 15 sec reload) the KV-1 is better at tier 5, its a joke surely?

 

So here's my question: How do you grind this awful tank?

 

Is it THAT much different from it's tier8 predecessor? Honestly... 



Calmb4 #7 Posted 29 November 2019 - 01:18 PM

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View PostTungstenHitman, on 29 November 2019 - 01:15 PM, said:

 

Is it THAT much different from it's tier8 predecessor? Honestly... 

Yeh that was pretty bad as well, the HE behemouth, still the O-Ni was awesome, loved that tank.  



Spurtung #8 Posted 29 November 2019 - 01:23 PM

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View PostCalmb4, on 29 November 2019 - 12:10 PM, said:

TBH man I do better with fast tanks and flanking, my mate plays the super heavies, so I have a couple. I mostly play LT, MT's and TD's. Usually when I hit tier 8/9 I start a new line so they dont get played alot. But if you think the Type 4 is a good tank you'll need to explain yourself. No mobility, cant flex, low pen with stock gun, stars need to align to have a good match, no arty, few high level TD's, no gold ammo lol. Has the HP to trade well but at 15 sec reload pffft not going to being putting out much damage. Its a preemptive tank, and that's half the problem, I know where I want to go but getting there without losing half my health is significant.

i get it you've 75k games under ur belt, to you I'm a noob but i stand firm Type4 in most matches is trash, it requires alot of luck in the matchmaker to have a good game. 

 

You may very well do better, but you still don't do well, I'm afraid.

 

I didn't say the tank was good, by the way, only that it wasn't that awful. For starters, you have all the armor you'll ever get on it right from stock, which is already better than 90% of the other HTs out there.

 

Sidescrape to the "wrong side", as if you're turning a corner while driving, and protect the corners of the hull at all costs: those are soft enough on their own without you presenting them to enemy shots at perpendicular angles. No mobility is part of its "job requirements", so use some free xp, get that top gun and start trading shots.

 

If you're losing a lot of HP getting to where you want to go, I'd argue you shouldn't pick the shortest route from A to B.

 

Bait shots, block as much as possible, and mostly trade hp using that top gun's alpha.

12:24 Added after 0 minute

View PostTungstenHitman, on 29 November 2019 - 12:15 PM, said:

Is it THAT much different from it's tier8 predecessor? Honestly... 

 

It has a way better frontal gun depression while not losing anything for that gain.



TungstenHitman #9 Posted 29 November 2019 - 01:28 PM

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View PostCalmb4, on 29 November 2019 - 12:18 PM, said:

Yeh that was pretty bad as well, the HE behemouth, still the O-Ni was awesome, loved that tank.  

 

Tier9 is traditionally the most painful grinds in the game since it just takes the most XP for everything plus that tends to combined with needing the top turret to mount the top gun or at least for the top gun to perform properly plus to mount those you need the tracks or without have to use basically just 2 slots since the 3rd slot is a suspension thingy to mount the turret and gun without the tracks and if its a quick tank you also have a pretty vulnerable tank until you also unlock the top engine lol... ya we quickly forget about that part! The Obj 430 has a broken grind though, whereby its pretty much the same as the best it can be at stock lol. That certainly made it a lot more fun than a stock T-54 and HELL of a lot more fun than a stock Leo! That said though, both of those tanks then passed out the 430 in performance once they were fully grinded so... ya, there's some really painful grinds at tier9 for sure. 


Edited by TungstenHitman, 29 November 2019 - 01:29 PM.


Calmb4 #10 Posted 29 November 2019 - 01:33 PM

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View PostSpurtung, on 29 November 2019 - 01:23 PM, said:

 

You may very well do better, but you still don't do well, I'm afraid.

 

I didn't say the tank was good, by the way, only that it wasn't that awful. For starters, you have all the armor you'll ever get on it right from stock, which is already better than 90% of the other HTs out there.

 

Sidescrape to the "wrong side", as if you're turning a corner while driving, and protect the corners of the hull at all costs: those are soft enough on their own without you presenting them to enemy shots at perpendicular angles. No mobility is part of its "job requirements", so use some free xp, get that top gun and start trading shots.

 

If you're losing a lot of HP getting to where you want to go, I'd argue you shouldn't pick the shortest route from A to B.

 

Bait shots, block as much as possible, and mostly trade hp using that top gun's alpha.

12:24 Added after 0 minute

 

It has a way better frontal gun depression while not losing anything for that gain.

Now that's better advice, I hated the O-HO's unique gun depression, which is a highlight of the Type 4. I yes i am always learning to get better at this game, understanding the minimap, I would say I've made alot of gains this year compared to last though I chose some god awful grinds (shivers at the memory of the churchill's). Tier 9/10 doesn't put me off, I like the challenge and i get better. 

The shortest route, I do try to take the safest route to where I'm going but the Type 4 is a big old girl, can't make her invisible (I wish) and it is very much map dependant. You have check the map, see where the teams going to be and try to preempt where you should be to be of some use.

But hey we all like a rant now and then ;)

12:36 Added after 2 minute

View PostTungstenHitman, on 29 November 2019 - 01:28 PM, said:

 

Tier9 is traditionally the most painful grinds in the game since it just takes the most XP for everything plus that tends to combined with needing the top turret to mount the top gun or at least for the top gun to perform properly plus to mount those you need the tracks or without have to use basically just 2 slots since the 3rd slot is a suspension thingy to mount the turret and gun without the tracks and if its a quick tank you also have a pretty vulnerable tank until you also unlock the top engine lol... ya we quickly forget about that part! The Obj 430 has a broken grind though, whereby its pretty much the same as the best it can be at stock lol. That certainly made it a lot more fun than a stock T-54 and HELL of a lot more fun than a stock Leo! That said though, both of those tanks then passed out the 430 in performance once they were fully grinded so... ya, there's some really painful grinds at tier9 for sure. 

yeh lol the 430, I unlocked just because it's ready to go, where my poor WZ 120 is still sitting there, I just cant put myself through that grind just now, it's torture.



leggasiini #11 Posted 29 November 2019 - 01:40 PM

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Type 4 stock grind is horrendous, and they made it even worse when they changed the research order of the 14 cm and 15 cm guns (and 15 cm after the nerfs is complete trash and not really any better than the stock 12.7 cm). You need to grind like 150k XP to get the tank into a playable state, but hey, at least you got a choice of two trash guns, right?

 

Just get yourself into corners, don't sit in open, poke corners (dont sidescrape) and try to trade. Its harder with 450 alpha, but its still decent against some tanks. Don't be too aggressive, the DPM is too awful for that. Don't get overly confident with your armor, its strong but against some guns it just doesn't work reliably. And generally hope you get a good matchup, since even when stock the Type can bully tier 7s and some tier 8s.

 

Things get better when you get the 14 cm as with that gun you can outtrade most tanks you face, and the pen is solid enough. 

 

Types aren't as good as they used to be and they aren't quite as good as the O-I / O-Ni (which are still broken, tbh), but they can still be playable as long as you dont use the 15 cm derp, dont get too confident with the armor and position yourself carefully. However, between O-Ho being bad now (rip ;__; ) and Type 4 stock grind being horrendous, they aren't really that worth it, Maus is better overall and aside from Tiger P has more comfortable grind, too. That being said, if the Sandbox ammo changes pass through, the Types should become a lot better again (they will more or less benefit from the change a lot; gold ammo rebalance effectively buffs their HP due to how their armor works, especially on the Type 5). 

 

View PostTungstenHitman, on 29 November 2019 - 02:15 PM, said:

 

Is it THAT much different from it's tier8 predecessor? Honestly... 

It is actually, the guns are completely different, armor layout is somewhat different (O-Ho's armor is generally worse but it has more sloping overall, turret is different and cheek weakspots aren't as prominent) and it doesnt have limitations with frontal gun depression.

 

Especially if he used the HE gun (which he did, if I understood right), the Type 4 can feel pretty different (you don't want to use the HE gun on this and Type 5, they are really bad).


Edited by leggasiini, 29 November 2019 - 01:43 PM.


vonadnan #12 Posted 29 November 2019 - 01:42 PM

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View PostTungstenHitman, on 29 November 2019 - 12:15 PM, said:

 

Is it THAT much different from it's tier8 predecessor? Honestly... 

Honestly Tungsten I feel like O-Ho has got the best armor tier for tier, but I may be wrong, also coming from perspective of shooting at them, not receiving :) 



leggasiini #13 Posted 29 November 2019 - 01:45 PM

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View Postvonadnan, on 29 November 2019 - 02:42 PM, said:

Honestly Tungsten I feel like O-Ho has got the best armor tier for tier

No.

 

It's more "troll" than other Japanese HTs because the O-Ho has more trollish sloped angles, but overall the armor is the worst out of them all. The massive pen powercreep at tier 8 hurt its armor quite a bit over years. Unlike most other Japanese HTs, it can't reliably bounce standard shells from same tier HTs or in many cases even from MTs.



feoffle3 #14 Posted 29 November 2019 - 01:46 PM

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Type-4 was awful, Type-5 is better, but the armour still doesn't count for much when Chinese/Russians load 330+ HEAT.

 

As mentioned, the best way to play, is to bait shots by poking the front out at an angle so that the inside "shoulder" plate isn't showing. Your armour becomes a lot more effective and the thick tracks help.

 

The Type-5 is still playable like this without the 15cm P2W ammunition, but as soon as an enemy sees the flat front of your turret, most gold rounds just go straight through without any problems.



Spurtung #15 Posted 29 November 2019 - 01:48 PM

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View PostCalmb4, on 29 November 2019 - 12:33 PM, said:

Now that's better advice, I hated the O-HO's unique gun depression, which is a highlight of the Type 4. I yes i am always learning to get better at this game, understanding the minimap, I would say I've made alot of gains this year compared to last though I chose some god awful grinds (shivers at the memory of the churchill's). Tier 9/10 doesn't put me off, I like the challenge and i get better. 

The shortest route, I do try to take the safest route to where I'm going but the Type 4 is a big old girl, can't make her invisible (I wish) and it is very much map dependant. You have check the map, see where the teams going to be and try to preempt where you should be to be of some use.

But hey we all like a rant now and then ;)

12:36 Added after 2 minute

yeh lol the 430, I unlocked just because it's ready to go, where my poor WZ 120 is still sitting there, I just cant put myself through that grind just now, it's torture.

 

I've literally just picked it up for a match to prove a point, played horribly wrong just for the sake of blocking damage. Note: I don't even have the first skill on the crew so I didn't know when I got spotted.

 

Victory!
Battle: Fjords 
Vehicles: Type 4 Heavy
Experience received: 4.712 (x4 for the first victory each day)
Bonds received: 1
Credits earned: 41.067
Battle achievements: Steel Wall, Cool-Headed, Mastery Badge: "Class II"

 

5050 blocked, including HEAT shells, full tier 9 battle.

 

Want the replay?

 


Edited by Spurtung, 29 November 2019 - 01:51 PM.


Calmb4 #16 Posted 29 November 2019 - 01:50 PM

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View Postleggasiini, on 29 November 2019 - 01:40 PM, said:

Especially if he used the HE gun (which he did, if I understood right), the Type 4 can feel pretty different (you don't want to use the HE gun on this and Type 5, they are really bad).

Actually no i didn't use the HE, I tried and hated it and went with the 300 alpha 215 pen and much better dpm. On a different note the WG gods where in my favour and I got alot of Type 4 blueprints, cost me just over 100k XP to unlock it :D

12:57 Added after 7 minute

I should point out I'm not a big fan of super heavies but my gaming buddy is, it's nice roll out in platoon in the same tank. I do have the Mauschen from doing the ToTT though I mite sell it and go back to the VK 100 01 P, that was such a joy to play, best super heavy I've played so far.

I tend unlock the top guns and then shelve the tank and work on something else. ATM I'm addicted to the Swedish tank lines, that gun depression and seige mode, i love it :D 

13:00 Added after 10 minute

One thing I do like about the Type 4, bar it's reload and aim time the gun does seem to hit it's target even at range, maybe its just a big TD ;)

 


Edited by Calmb4, 29 November 2019 - 01:50 PM.


evcro #17 Posted 29 November 2019 - 02:05 PM

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you are wasting your time

 

japanese heavies are horrible, HP pinata

 

everytime i see a japanese heavy in the enemy team i think "yummy" and "better chance to win"



Calmb4 #18 Posted 29 November 2019 - 02:05 PM

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Im just reading that reverse side scrapping with the Type 4 is a thing, I'll give that ago, should hide that pesky weak point.

Poulakiou #19 Posted 29 November 2019 - 02:09 PM

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No matter how you position that tank, you will always be penetrated 100% because everyone loads gold ammo just at the sight of you. Good luck leveling to tier X, I have type 4 heavy like 5 months and still haven't gotten tier X.

Edited by Poulakiou, 29 November 2019 - 02:09 PM.


RetroCh1cken #20 Posted 29 November 2019 - 02:21 PM

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Ah, I remember the days these tanks were the devil itself to face, the days were half of my heavy tanks hp pool could get ripped away by one shot and couldn't pen back...

God I'm thankfull they aren't like these anymore..




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