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History example I : 2 Panthers vs. 21 shermans

History panther Sherman

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SamuraiShakaViking #1 Posted 22 December 2019 - 02:13 AM

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The Tank Battlefield:

2 Panthers vs. 21 Shermans

https://m.youtube.co...h?v=86K0ncTkAkA



Nishi_Kinuyo #2 Posted 22 December 2019 - 10:43 AM

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Sorry, but.... why would it be 21 Shermans?

The smallest tank division the murikans had at the time was a unit of 5, so four such units would make 20 while five such units would make 25.



Bulldog_Drummond #3 Posted 22 December 2019 - 12:25 PM

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View PostSamuraiShakaViking, on 22 December 2019 - 01:13 AM, said:

The Tank Battlefield:

2 Panthers vs. 21 Shermans

https://m.youtube.co...h?v=86K0ncTkAkA

 

Interesting short video, thanks for posting

While a very impressive little action on the part of the small German task force, it wasn't exactly 2 vs 21 in a straightforward tank vs tank action, being a series of separate actions, with 12 of the Shermans surrendering, and at least one of the 9 destroyed taken out with a panzerfaust.

My guess is that the surrender was a combination of surprise, poor US morale, inexperienced US troops, battle weariness, and the Shermans in the town being parked in such a way that they couldn't easily get out.

Personally, if I had been a US soldier I would have thought twice before surrendering to an SS unit.

 

View PostNishi_Kinuyo, on 22 December 2019 - 09:43 AM, said:

Sorry, but.... why would it be 21 Shermans?

The smallest tank division the murikans had at the time was a unit of 5, so four such units would make 20 while five such units would make 25.

 

Because after two weeks of combat in the sector it would be unusual to find a tank company with its platoon numbers and organisation intact.

The narrative suggests that this was in fact the remnants of a tank battalion

And you might just as well ask why 2 Panthers?

US, British and German forces at the time all emphasised task forces rather than sticking to the TO&E, which was largely administrative.  However, German doctrine was significantly more flexible and effective.



monthey_ #4 Posted 22 December 2019 - 12:43 PM

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Interesting video. Had a chuckle when I realized Bachman died at the age of 88.

 

Thanks for sharing.



Nishi_Kinuyo #5 Posted 22 December 2019 - 09:30 PM

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View PostBulldog_Drummond, on 22 December 2019 - 12:25 PM, said:

And you might just as well ask why 2 Panthers?

Oh that one's easy: the others broke down before they got to the action.



Bulldog_Drummond #6 Posted 22 December 2019 - 09:42 PM

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View PostNishi_Kinuyo, on 22 December 2019 - 08:30 PM, said:

Oh that one's easy: the others broke down before they got to the action.

 

Very possibly, or maybe, as the clip notes, they were the Panthers knocked out by the Yanks on the initial approach along the road (I'm guessing they were shot in the side in line formation). 

Personally I'd rate the Panther as easily the best tank of the war in tank vs tank combat

But of course most combat wasn't tank vs tank, it was a platoon firing HE support to help an infantry company or two, and the Sherman was fine for that.  






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