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My god, I don't want to be top tier and meet tier 4s, for the last time.

KV-2 MoE MM

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Ratriq #1 Posted 03 January 2020 - 09:36 PM

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If for one thing, I didn't this would be the most annoying part with trying to mark a KV-2. I was lucky for a while and only met t7 & t8s which made me able to increase my MoE to 88%.
Now like 60% of the time I've been top tier the last few days. I normally enjoy being top tier but marking a tank such as the KV-2 which is all about dmg makes pretty hard to get dmg when the tank you shoot got half of your average dmg as their total HP.

Is too much to ask for to be able to at least have an option to willingly be bottom tier? Cause I know marking the KV-2 is a lot about luck but my god, this feels like the most pointless thing to be the reason why I drop a half % almost every battle when I'm top tier cause the enemy actually doesn't have enough HP.

azakow #2 Posted 03 January 2020 - 09:54 PM

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View PostRatriq, on 03 January 2020 - 09:36 PM, said:

If for one thing, I didn't this would be the most annoying part with trying to mark a KV-2. I was lucky for a while and only met t7 & t8s which made me able to increase my MoE to 88%.
Now like 60% of the time I've been top tier the last few days. I normally enjoy being top tier but marking a tank such as the KV-2 which is all about dmg makes pretty hard to get dmg when the tank you shoot got half of your average dmg as their total HP.

Is too much to ask for to be able to at least have an option to willingly be bottom tier? Cause I know marking the KV-2 is a lot about luck but my god, this feels like the most pointless thing to be the reason why I drop a half % almost every battle when I'm top tier cause the enemy actually doesn't have enough HP.

Did you know, that the MM is actually clever?

3 MoE must be worth something, which includes the high RoF low tiers as well.

 

Pleae also consider der "fear" infront of your gun.


Edited by azakow, 03 January 2020 - 09:55 PM.


Bulldog_Drummond #3 Posted 03 January 2020 - 10:00 PM

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View PostRatriq, on 03 January 2020 - 08:36 PM, said:

If for one thing, I didn't this would be the most annoying part with trying to mark a KV-2. I was lucky for a while and only met t7 & t8s which made me able to increase my MoE to 88%.
Now like 60% of the time I've been top tier the last few days. I normally enjoy being top tier but marking a tank such as the KV-2 which is all about dmg makes pretty hard to get dmg when the tank you shoot got half of your average dmg as their total HP.

Is too much to ask for to be able to at least have an option to willingly be bottom tier? Cause I know marking the KV-2 is a lot about luck but my god, this feels like the most pointless thing to be the reason why I drop a half % almost every battle when I'm top tier cause the enemy actually doesn't have enough HP.

 

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Ratriq #4 Posted 03 January 2020 - 10:04 PM

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View Postazakow, on 03 January 2020 - 08:54 PM, said:

Did you know, that the MM is actually clever?

3 MoE must be worth something, which includes the high RoF low tiers as well.

 

Pleae also consider der "fear" infront of your gun.

Yes of course but generally the MoE isn't literally that dependent on that you are a bottom tier to actually have a chance of doing enough dmg. The KV-2 is one of the only tanks where it's this dependent. 
It's already hard enough with it being so dependent on luck by not getting overrun by enemies, scoring high dpm cause of how reliable HE is, not missing shots thanks to rng, and so on.



unhappy_bunny #5 Posted 04 January 2020 - 03:18 AM

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So now we want the MM to take into consideration:

 

The class of tank,

The tier of the tank,

The skill of the player,

The recent battle results of the player,

And the MOE% of that player in that tank. 

 

Should make forming teams a doddle. 

 



Ratriq #6 Posted 04 January 2020 - 03:22 AM

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View Postunhappy_bunny, on 04 January 2020 - 02:18 AM, said:

So now we want the MM to take into consideration:

 

The class of tank,

The tier of the tank,

The skill of the player,

The recent battle results of the player,

And the MOE% of that player in that tank. 

 

Should make forming teams a doddle. 

 

I mean it's more me feeling that it should be an option for enabling something like this since this literally doesn't hurt anyone, if, for one thing, it helps the MM cause people want to be top tier and most don't want to be bottom tier, if some people want to willingly be bottom tier this would fill this gap by a tiny bit.



NUKLEAR_SLUG #7 Posted 04 January 2020 - 07:36 AM

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If you want to deserve your MoE you have to be able to do it even when you get given the bad matchups as well not just when you get given the good ones. 

PowJay #8 Posted 04 January 2020 - 07:49 AM

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View PostNUKLEAR_SLUG, on 04 January 2020 - 06:36 AM, said:

If you want to deserve your MoE you have to be able to do it even when you get given the bad matchups as well not just when you get given the good ones.

Exactly. You are only being judged by the abilities of other players in the SAME vehicle who face exactly the same frustrations as yourself. It drives you crazy, but trying to three mark is like that. I have only managed to three-mark the Crusader, which many say is VERY easy. For me, the last few % was anything but easy.


 

I got very close in the Archer before dropping away again. I have largely given that up for now. I am currently- or at least after the festive period- trying to three-mark the StuG III G and I was having a hell of a frustrating afternoon when a great battle jumped me to 93.5%. It will drop several times, probably, unless I get very lucky, very soon. But I should get there eventually. I am using more APCR and Directives in my next battles to help things along.



malachi6 #9 Posted 04 January 2020 - 09:40 AM

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The vast majority of MM complaints on this forum appear to regard being "always bottom tier".  Funny how when somebody wants that, the MM is still broken.  This, in my opinion, kinda proves that the MM is working and people are selectively choosing its faults,

Edited by malachi6, 04 January 2020 - 09:41 AM.


RaxipIx #10 Posted 04 January 2020 - 09:43 AM

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As i mentioned in an earlier post kv-2 is probably one of the harder tier 6's to 3 mark, because it has more of a luck factor then other tanks.

You can't spot, no rof to keep tanks tracked, so mostly you need  dmg, and it's neither mobile nor is it reliable on getting the damage done game after game.

 

Hence it's tricky to 3 mark, i personally never bothered getting it on the tank, but if you enjoy playing it then by all means go for it , but don't get to fixated because it will cause  frustration in the long run, esp once you get to 92-3%.



Ratriq #11 Posted 04 January 2020 - 07:35 PM

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View PostNUKLEAR_SLUG, on 04 January 2020 - 06:36 AM, said:

If you want to deserve your MoE you have to be able to do it even when you get given the bad matchups as well not just when you get given the good ones. 

Yes exactly, it should be deserved but what exactly is deserving if you manage to mark it you and know half of the reason you managed to mark it was cause of luck? I'm completely fine with knowing I'm unable to third mark the KV-2 cause of my skill, I'll work on it the whole year if that is what it takes, what my problem is, what's limiting me the most shouldn't be my luck.

Again, any player KV-2 player can make it work when top tier and rack up damage, the problem comes again that if you want a third mark, it's more about luck then skill to get that 1,4/1,8k dmg since sometimes it's literally a third of the enemy teams total HP.
But only skilled KV-2 players can truly always make it work when being bottom tier and knowing when to use AP and HE on what enemies since that's when it is the most rewarding and most punishing if you do it wrong.

Allowing players to willingly become bottom tier would only make marking the KV-2 more about skill and less about luck, as it should be. I wouldn't be surprised if this actually would raise the needed MoE dmg for a third mark since it will be easier for skilled players to get consistently high dmg.
To actually give you an idea how much about luck it is with this tank, I was at 88% at one moment had been bottom tier most of the games then suddenly RNG thought it would be fun to screw me over and both miss my shots, get the worst maps and of course become top tier and face tier 4s which I normally never face. I went from 88%, almost down to 80%. That's how much this tank is about luck.



divsmo #12 Posted 04 January 2020 - 08:02 PM

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It will always be down to luck to a certain extent anyway, as even if you were to get the tier you want the map rotation can just as easily screw you over. The skill part comes in when you choose how to play those maps or tiers which don't suit your specific tank.
It took me 4+ goes of getting to above 94% on the wz131 then dropping back to 90-92% before i 3 marked it. As others have said 85-90% isn't too bad but the last 5% can be a killer.

Ratriq #13 Posted 04 January 2020 - 08:08 PM

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View Postdivsmo, on 04 January 2020 - 07:02 PM, said:

It will always be down to luck to a certain extent anyway, as even if you were to get the tier you want the map rotation can just as easily screw you over. The skill part comes in when you choose how to play those maps or tiers which don't suit your specific tank.
It took me 4+ goes of getting to above 94% on the wz131 then dropping back to 90-92% before i 3 marked it. As others have said 85-90% isn't too bad but the last 5% can be a killer.

Yes, of course, there is always some degree of luck involved but if there is chance of turning the luck down by a bit and more into skilful play which the KV-2 is lacking a lot of right now it's would at least help and make it less frustrating to mark it cause it will be more about you being the problem, rather than the luck.

Again, this suggestion doesn't even have any drawbacks, for one it would actually help MM since if more players willingly want to be bottom tier, fewer people who doesn't want to be will not be bottom tier. It's literally a win/win.



Cobra6 #14 Posted 04 January 2020 - 08:21 PM

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Good old time where if you wanted to ensure you'd be bottom tier, you'd just platoon with your friends when they were playing two tiers higher.

Occasionally I'd take my KV-2 into Tier 10 battles and still frequently be top damage dealer, man I had fun. And tons of XP/credits afterwards of course since you are damaging way above your tier ^_^

 

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Ratriq #15 Posted 04 January 2020 - 09:05 PM

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View PostCobra6, on 04 January 2020 - 07:21 PM, said:

Good old time where if you wanted to ensure you'd be bottom tier, you'd just platoon with your friends when they were playing two tiers higher.

Occasionally I'd take my KV-2 into Tier 10 battles and still frequently be top damage dealer, man I had fun. And tons of XP/credits afterwards of course since you are damaging way above your tier ^_^

 

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Oh wow, I didn't even think about the KV-2s ability to do stuff like that still in against t10 tanks. I don't know what is more surprising, the fact that the KV-2 HE is still strong enough to make it the top dmg dealer in your team or the fact that other t10 tanks gets outplayed by a t6 tank.

I can't imagine the salt though from the players playing a t10 heavy and getting killed by a tier 6 tank. :teethhappy:



Cobra6 #16 Posted 04 January 2020 - 09:54 PM

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View PostRatriq, on 04 January 2020 - 08:05 PM, said:

Oh wow, I didn't even think about the KV-2s ability to do stuff like that still in against t10 tanks. I don't know what is more surprising, the fact that the KV-2 HE is still strong enough to make it the top dmg dealer in your team or the fact that other t10 tanks gets outplayed by a t6 tank.

I can't imagine the salt though from the players playing a t10 heavy and getting killed by a tier 6 tank. :teethhappy:

 

It was glorious, especially if your own team rages at the start that you were in a so called "fail platoon" and then you beat them as well.

 

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Balc0ra #17 Posted 05 January 2020 - 01:05 AM

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I have the same issue with the KV-220 with top tier and equal tier games. And even if I kill everything I face on that lane. Not enough HP to go around to get the mark to rise most games, as he needs a bit more then most mid-tiers.

Nishi_Kinuyo #18 Posted 05 January 2020 - 01:28 AM

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View PostRatriq, on 04 January 2020 - 09:05 PM, said:

Oh wow, I didn't even think about the KV-2s ability to do stuff like that still in against t10 tanks. I don't know what is more surprising, the fact that the KV-2 HE is still strong enough to make it the top dmg dealer in your team or the fact that other t10 tanks gets outplayed by a t6 tank.

I can't imagine the salt though from the players playing a t10 heavy and getting killed by a tier 6 tank. :teethhappy:

Well yeah, why else do you think it is one of the most broken tanks in the game? :facepalm:



piratha #19 Posted 05 January 2020 - 01:29 AM

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View PostCobra6, on 04 January 2020 - 09:54 PM, said:

 

It was glorious, especially if your own team rages at the start that you were in a so called "fail platoon" and then you beat them as well.

 

Cobra 6

 

Fail platoon is a thing I'd like to see back :justwait:



Bulldog_Drummond #20 Posted 05 January 2020 - 01:41 AM

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View PostBalc0ra, on 05 January 2020 - 12:05 AM, said:

I have the same issue with the KV-220 with top tier and equal tier games. And even if I kill everything I face on that lane. Not enough HP to go around to get the mark to rise most games, as he needs a bit more then most mid-tiers.

 

I have thousands of games in that and still only MOE 1






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