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Impact of Premium Shells on Personal Score and statistics


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Eagle__ #1 Posted 27 April 2020 - 08:11 PM

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Greetings,

 

I want to propose a very good and reasonable addition to personal score calculation.

 

I think that the rate of use of premium ammo/shells should be included in calculation of personal score and player statistics. I prefer to play with skills not with premium shells even though i can affrod it, it is availble for credits, but it makes the gameplay not as interesting to me as it could be.

With standard shells i need to think more, make the strategy, aim weak spots and this makes the game interesting, but with premium shells the players don't need any brain to aim weak spots, you can shoot everywhere with premium shells and still you will penetrate with high chance. No need to aim weak spots and use skills.

 

This is why i think it would be fair if the rate of premium shell use would be included in calculation of players' personal rating and scores. Because some players use skills to aim weak spots and etc, but others just use premium ammo and they dont need any skills.

 

I guess if the premium ammo use ratio is included in personal score calculation then many players with good unicum (purple) stats will turn tomato (red), they will loose their stats and those tomatoes who don't use premium shells often will turn to unicum.

 

I think it is pretty logical and reasonable suggesstion, think about that.



chessstud #2 Posted 27 April 2020 - 08:13 PM

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Better to just get rid of the entire thing. The problem is that Wargaming isn't interested in skill-based gaming, and just wants people to buy gold to convert into credits to use to spam gold at tier 10.

Private_Miros #3 Posted 27 April 2020 - 08:15 PM

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Extra penetration is obviously an advantage but a) it's the very last skill you need to be good at the game, because that's all game reading and positioning and has nothing to do with penetration, which only gives an advantage when you master that, and you are already in the top 5% if you do that regardless of ammo; and b) pressing 2 is not a skill, any tomato does it and... remains tomato.

 

Ammo, armor and old power-creeped vs new tanks in general can take a serious rebalance overall.


Edited by Private_Miros, 27 April 2020 - 08:28 PM.


speedphlux #4 Posted 27 April 2020 - 08:18 PM

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Too late for this thing to be included. Few years ago people were arguing what was the best tool to determine "who's PP is biggest" and all agreed that this would've been Average Base XP score, but since WG didn't include that statistic from Day 1, we can't count it on not being manipulated by Premium Account, so no - there is no way NOW to determine "who's PP is biggest". Sorry.

Oh, and Premium Ammo does not make you better player. If you don't know where to aim with Premium Ammo, specially if its HEAT, you're just gonna make a fool out of yourself, as seen by the many JgPzE-100s that fire HEAT and bounce from my Leopard 1.

pihip #5 Posted 27 April 2020 - 08:20 PM

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While it would be fun to check statcards if this were implemented, it would only lead to naming and shaming and little else. Gold ammo addicts will stay gold ammo addicts even with this feature marking them as such.

Private_Miros #6 Posted 27 April 2020 - 08:28 PM

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View Postfor_Nooblord, on 27 April 2020 - 07:20 PM, said:

While it would be fun to check statcards if this were implemented, it would only lead to naming and shaming and little else. Gold ammo addicts will stay gold ammo addicts even with this feature marking them as such.

 

Eh, maybe not. I see some popular streamers use less gold than they otherwise would use, just to please their viewers.



splash_time #7 Posted 27 April 2020 - 08:34 PM

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Premium ammo is not always about penetration. As if I see a T30 hulldown, I'll load HEAT to penetrate his coupla, not because it has higher penetration, but because it can penetrate angled armour more reliably compared to AP and APCR that can bounce more often. 

Does that make me a gold noob? Or I'm using my shell types knowledge? 

 

And if you face a Maus/Type 5, what you'll do? Spam HE? Or destroy them by looking at them?

A good player will always rely on his skills.



GodTank2 #8 Posted 27 April 2020 - 08:35 PM

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View PostEagle__, on 27 April 2020 - 09:11 PM, said:

 I prefer to play with skills not with premium shells even though i can affrod it, it is availble for credits, but it makes the gameplay not as interesting to me as it could be.

With standard shells i need to think more, make the strategy, aim weak spots and this makes the game interesting, but with premium shells the players don't need any brain to aim weak spots, you can shoot everywhere with premium shells and still you will penetrate with high chance. No need to aim weak spots and use skills.

 

You do 4-5 shots of damage on average at tier 10. Is that the skill you are referring to?



totallynotqsr #9 Posted 27 April 2020 - 09:35 PM

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Shooting weakspots with ap and bouncing because of bad RNG = "skills"

Shooting weakspots with prem ammo and penning = noob

Got it OP :)



Long_Range_Sniper #10 Posted 27 April 2020 - 10:03 PM

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View PostEagle__, on 27 April 2020 - 07:11 PM, said:

I guess if the premium ammo use ratio is included in personal score calculation then many players with good unicum (purple) stats will turn tomato (red), they will loose their stats and those tomatoes who don't use premium shells often will turn to unicum.

 

What do you estimate to be the WN8 you deserve?



Nishi_Kinuyo #11 Posted 27 April 2020 - 10:23 PM

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Should be easy to check I'd say; just make two new accounts, one where you don't use gold, and one where you use only gold. And then, after reaching a certain point with both, compare the results.



barison1 #12 Posted 27 April 2020 - 10:28 PM

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View PostEagle__, on 27 April 2020 - 08:11 PM, said:

 

I guess if the premium ammo use ratio is included in personal score calculation then many players with good unicum (purple) stats will turn tomato (red), they will loose their stats and those tomatoes who don't use premium shells often will turn to unicum.

why dont you try bunch games full gold? should be instant unicum stats then right?

 

 

just to support the argument that gold doesnt turn unicums into tomatoes;

http://forum.worldoftanks.eu/index.php?/topic/648441-the-gold-vs-standard-ammo-challenge-5k-gold-prize/#topmost

all the challengers who did better full gold than the unicum full standard, oh wait there wasnt any

 

and there been more of those challenges/tests which all kept showing unicums will remain unicums even full standard. but sure be my guest to believe your skills are superior and that gold ammo is the only part that makes unicums unicums and not the boring map reading, situational awareness and positioning


Edited by barison1, 27 April 2020 - 10:37 PM.


UrQuan #13 Posted 27 April 2020 - 10:56 PM

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Considering the amount of prem shells that still bounce on my tanks, I say people should learn how penning, armor, angles & shell mechanics work. Else you're just throwing around very expensive ammo for no reason.

 

And I assure you, the amount of prem spam has no correlation with skill. Enough folks who switch to prem ammo, thinking 'hah now his armor is useless' and then proceed to keep dinging me with that prem shell as well.

But if using prem ammo would drag down the rating, trust me, you'll discover rock bottom will make reds look like unicums.

 

 

 



AXIS_OF_RESISTANCE #14 Posted 27 April 2020 - 11:03 PM

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Mad cus bad .



arthurwellsley #15 Posted 27 April 2020 - 11:09 PM

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View PostEagle__, on 27 April 2020 - 07:11 PM, said:

Greetings,

 

I want to propose a very good and reasonable addition to personal score calculation.

 

I think that the rate of use of premium ammo/shells should be included in calculation of personal score and player statistics. I prefer to play with skills not with premium shells even though i can affrod it, it is availble for credits, but it makes the gameplay not as interesting to me as it could be.

With standard shells i need to think more, make the strategy, aim weak spots and this makes the game interesting, but with premium shells the players don't need any brain to aim weak spots, you can shoot everywhere with premium shells and still you will penetrate with high chance. No need to aim weak spots and use skills.

 

This is why i think it would be fair if the rate of premium shell use would be included in calculation of players' personal rating and scores. Because some players use skills to aim weak spots and etc, but others just use premium ammo and they dont need any skills.

 

I guess [Guessing will get you no where without proof] if the premium ammo use ratio is included in personal score calculation then many players with good unicum (purple) stats will turn tomato (red), they will loose their stats and those tomatoes who don't use premium shells often will turn to unicum.

 

I think it is pretty logical and reasonable suggesstion, think about that.

 

You are wrong. Not only that if you are incapable of learning when to use the 2 key when necessary you are a liability to your team mates in a team game.

 

To prove that you are wrong, first here is an experiment where a unicum creates a free to play account and recorded a 900 game streak. Even without using gold and food he was still a unicum = http://forum.worldof...iment-finished/

 

Also as barison1 posted above. brumbarr a purple unicum set a challenge, any tank, 100 games he would play no gold, the other player could use gold ammo to see if anyone could beat his results. Answer they could not. That challenge is here = http://forum.worldoftanks.eu/index.php?/topic/648441-the-gold-vs-standard-ammo-challenge-5k-gold-prize/#topmost

 

Next time OP you come up with what you think is "pretty logical and reasonable suggestion". Try and look for empirical proof first. brumbarr and AngelofAwe prove your "feels" wrong over huge recorded game streaks, done in front of all the forum. Come back with another "reasonable suggestion" when you can back it with hundreds of recorded games available to see in your post that everyone can view  and see the statistics for.


Edited by arthurwellsley, 27 April 2020 - 11:12 PM.


Objec7 #16 Posted 27 April 2020 - 11:13 PM

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View PostEagle__, on 27 April 2020 - 08:11 PM, said:

Greetings,

 

I want to propose a very good and reasonable addition to personal score calculation.

 

I think that the rate of use of premium ammo/shells should be included in calculation of personal score and player statistics. I prefer to play with skills not with premium shells even though i can affrod it, it is availble for credits, but it makes the gameplay not as interesting to me as it could be.

With standard shells i need to think more, make the strategy, aim weak spots and this makes the game interesting, but with premium shells the players don't need any brain to aim weak spots, you can shoot everywhere with premium shells and still you will penetrate with high chance. No need to aim weak spots and use skills.

 

This is why i think it would be fair if the rate of premium shell use would be included in calculation of players' personal rating and scores. Because some players use skills to aim weak spots and etc, but others just use premium ammo and they dont need any skills.

 

I guess if the premium ammo use ratio is included in personal score calculation then many players with good unicum (purple) stats will turn tomato (red), they will loose their stats and those tomatoes who don't use premium shells often will turn to unicum.

 

I think it is pretty logical and reasonable suggesstion, think about that.

There are people with 4k wn8 who don't shoot a single premium ammo. You have 1.5k wn8. Why do you think premium ammo as a cheat? It's part of the game and balance of armor, you should think it as a end game item, you will be able to afford them easily when you become good enough in the game



_Signal_ #17 Posted 27 April 2020 - 11:15 PM

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A good player will be good regardless of what ammo he uses because ammo choice tbh is such a small part of being a good player.

Pansenmann #18 Posted 27 April 2020 - 11:16 PM

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you obviously omitted me playing ARL 44 with the 105mm
where the only viable choice is - gold ammo

 

because - why have 300 alpha when you can get 10% more?

 

there are tanks which are useless without premium ammo.

Take B1 or B2 for example.

or KV-1 with 57mm gun.



NUKLEAR_SLUG #19 Posted 28 April 2020 - 01:26 AM

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View PostEagle__, on 27 April 2020 - 08:11 PM, said:

I guess if the premium ammo use ratio is included in personal score calculation then many players with good unicum (purple) stats will turn tomato (red), they will loose their stats and those tomatoes who don't use premium shells often will turn to unicum.

 

I think it is pretty logical and reasonable suggesstion, think about that.

 

Cool, play for a week firing nothing but gold ammo then come back to us with your 60%+ WR for the week and we'll happily admit you were correct. 

 

Looking forward to next Tuesday.. 



xtrem3x #20 Posted 28 April 2020 - 02:01 AM

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Good players don't spam premium ammo, they know when to use it and when not to.

 

Bad players either don't use premium ammo at all so can't pen and kill the tank they need to to win the game, or they spam premium ammo and think the game is bugged when they can't pen people though their tracks.

 

Next time you're driving your paper tank and you get hit with premium ammo from a good player, instead of thinking they're spamming, why not have a look at the vehicle they were shooting before you? Chances are the premium ammo was used for them... 






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