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AMX 38 - the NOT light tank


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Ariser #1 Posted 05 January 2012 - 11:34 PM

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Hello. Today I started the french tree as many others did :) And everything seemed OK until...I met one really really ugly french light tank called AMX 38. I was with D2 and what I did was that I shot him in the lower hull, I shot him in the upper hull, I shot him in the turret, I shot him in the tracks, in the side hull, in the rear...I shot him every-f***ing-where and the only spot where I was able to penetrate this thing is the commander's cupola. I saw how 4 of our tier 2 and 3 tanks surrounded that "tank" and only one survived...4 out of 5 shots did not penetrated the AMX 38 armor. It just kept bouncing and bouncing - undestructable! Then after the game I looked at it's stats... 60/40/40 hull and stock turret armor for light tank tier 3. I was with D2 - medium tank tier 3 with stats of 40/40/40 hull armor and 46/46/46 best turret armor. Then I started to look at the other tier 3 tanks and here what I found:

BT-7 20/15/13 hull, 20/15/15 turret
T-46 15/15/15 hull, 15/15/15 turret
PzKpfw 38 (t) 25/15/15 hull, 25/15/15 turret
PzKpfw III Ausf. A  15/15/15 hull, 30/30/30 turret
PzKpfw II Luchs 30/20/20 hull, 50/30/30 turret
M3 Stuart 38/25/25 hull, 38/32/32 turret
M2 Medium Tank 32/18/13 hull, 38/25/25

The conclusion is that there is not a single tank so heavily armored as AMX 38, not even the 2 mediums. Many of you will say that the other tanks have sloped armor maybe, but we are talking about tier 3 tanks - mostly early WW2 light tanks when the sloped armor was not used so much and if you look at those tanks you will notice that they have box shaped hulls and turrets, vertical plates...pretty ugly designs :) And I asked myself what gun is needed to penetrate that tank? Do tier 3 tanks have such gun? Here are the best guns...

BT-7 "37 mm ZiS-19" 58mm penetration
T-46 "76 mm L-10" 105 penetration
PzKpfw 38 (t) "4,7 cm PaK 38 (t) L/43" 60mm penetration
PzKpfw III Ausf. A "5 cm KwK 38 L/42" 60mm penetration
PzKpfw II Luchs "5 cm KwK 38 L/42" 60mm penetration
M3 Stuart "37 mm Gun M-6" 56mm penetration
M2 Medium Tank "37 mm Gun M-6" 56mm penetration
D2 "47 mm SA37" 66mm penetration
AMX 38 "47 mm SA35" 45mm penetration

So there is only 1 gun that will penetrate this thing for sure. 4 others will may succeed if the range and angle are OK. And 4 do not have a chance. And for me that is not normal. So... I understand that the patch was released just today and there are many stats that will be changed over time. But I wonder how that thing passed the test server :) Hope it will be fixed soon.

Aqarius #2 Posted 05 January 2012 - 11:43 PM

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I was driving the AMX-38 today. Ran into another AMX-38. We stood there shooting each other like idiots for 4 minutes solid until arty took him out. 0 damage, both of us. Very, very weird tank.

typhaon #3 Posted 05 January 2012 - 11:43 PM

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Classification of tanks has not always something to do with the fighting power... especially the French show this... its mostly about the tank weight, and the AMX 38 is rather light... except for that, its armored and slow like a heavy...

klesk #4 Posted 05 January 2012 - 11:46 PM

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Tier III Light Tank: AMX 38

Armor
Hull Armor (mm)

    front 60
    sides 40
    rear 40

Turret Armor (mm)

    front 60
    sides 40
    rear 40

Tier IX Medium Tank: Bat Chatillon 25 t

Armor
Hull Armor (mm)

    front 60
    sides 40
    rear 30

Turret Armor (mm)

    front 50
    sides 30
    rear 15

French tanks are WEIRD as hell... in low tiers they are super-armored, slow and they have weak guns...
And in high tiers they have no armor, they are super-fast and they have great guns with autoloaders...

I think... French tank designers used acid.

klesk #5 Posted 05 January 2012 - 11:47 PM

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View PostAqarius, on 05 January 2012 - 11:43 PM, said:

I was driving the AMX-38 today. Ran into another AMX-38. We stood there shooting each other like idiots for 4 minutes solid until arty took him out. 0 damage, both of us. Very, very weird tank.

That happened to me several times...

And last time, me and another AMX38 just kinda... avoided each other and beat the crap out of other tanks  :lol:

Trent #6 Posted 05 January 2012 - 11:47 PM

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You're saying it's OP or that it shouldn't be classified as light?

Typhaon already explained the classification thing, and as for its "power":

It's tier 3 light, meaning that it can encounter up to tier 5 meds, heavies and TD.

I don't think AMX38's have it too easy in the average battle :P

Aqarius #7 Posted 05 January 2012 - 11:48 PM

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View Postklesk, on 05 January 2012 - 11:46 PM, said:

I think... French tank designers used acid.
Acid wasn't invented back then

You're thinking of opium. http://forum.worldof...mile_blinky.gif

dawdler #8 Posted 05 January 2012 - 11:55 PM

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View PostTrent, on 05 January 2012 - 11:47 PM, said:

It's tier 3 light, meaning that it can encounter up to tier 5 meds, heavies and TD.
That doesnt really change the fact its a wierd tank. It can just barely penetrate tier 2 artillery (while bouncing like 70% of the shots) and you are saying the fact it can encounter tiers it cant possibly penetrate as a counter to its armour? That's rather futile. It should work in its own tier, not be "balanced" by being useless cannonfodder against higher tiers.

Trent #9 Posted 06 January 2012 - 12:09 AM

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View Postdawdler, on 05 January 2012 - 11:55 PM, said:

That doesnt really change the fact its a wierd tank. It can just barely penetrate tier 2 artillery (while bouncing like 70% of the shots) and you are saying the fact it can encounter tiers it cant possibly penetrate as a counter to its armour? That's rather futile. It should work in its own tier, not be "balanced" by being useless cannonfodder against higher tiers.
Isn't Hotchkiss (German premium, not French) kind of the same thing for a tier 2?

Tytalus7 #10 Posted 06 January 2012 - 12:17 AM

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Just played a low level game with this Frenchie, same result:4 of us took him on, shot after shot after shot (2x PzKpfw 35t, another French tank and someone I couldn't see).  We all brought the farm.

In the end he went for CAP, while our sides remaining 4 tanks did the same, only way to win.

I know that the game is trying to recreate real vehicles, but having such an unbalanced machine really does take the fun out of it :(.

Aqarius #11 Posted 06 January 2012 - 12:17 AM

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View PostTrent, on 06 January 2012 - 12:09 AM, said:

Isn't Hotchkiss (German premium, not French) kind of the same thing for a tier 2?

You mean, the tank directly preceding the AMX-38 in the french tree?

Ariser #12 Posted 06 January 2012 - 12:21 AM

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The classification may be based on weight, but more armor means more weight. So for the weight that AMX 38 has, it can not be so well armored. And it is not balanced. This tank is only tier 3 and there is almost no other tank on its tier that can penetrate it.

SneakyStephan #13 Posted 06 January 2012 - 12:41 AM

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I'm already almost finished with it so I'll post the weak spot:p (well the only one I could find)
The view port on top of the turret, it won't always do damage but when it does you knock off like 20 percent.

Driver view port can be penned too and kills the driver but seems to do no damage.

Vahal #14 Posted 06 January 2012 - 12:54 AM

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if it was boosted as med that could be fine... no more meetings with KV3...  <_<

Trent #15 Posted 06 January 2012 - 01:12 AM

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View PostAqarius, on 06 January 2012 - 12:17 AM, said:

You mean, the tank directly preceding the AMX-38 in the french tree?
No, I meant German Mini-Maus, PzKpfw 38H735 (f). But they're both the same tank, with almost the same parameters at the first glance.

TrackLord #16 Posted 06 January 2012 - 05:11 AM

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Just said something about this tank in the other thread. I saw one take well in excess of 100 hits and not die while all of the 6 amx38s in the battle tanked dozens (in total hundreds) of shots before either dying or seeing the battle through till the end.

Tytalus7 #17 Posted 06 January 2012 - 10:28 AM

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View PostTrackLord, on 06 January 2012 - 05:11 AM, said:

Just said something about this tank in the other thread. I saw one take well in excess of 100 hits and not die while all of the 6 amx38s in the battle tanked dozens (in total hundreds) of shots before either dying or seeing the battle through till the end.

Other thread?  must go look...

Vahal #18 Posted 06 January 2012 - 10:41 AM

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if you don't aim with french 47mm you will bounce on AMX-38 even from side and when you d'ont bounce, shell is soaked by treads. I took 98 shells in one match and survived. I fired ALL my 80 47mm shells on 3 others AMX-38, killing all with difficulty. And after I had no problemU know why? cause I know where to aim now. And excepted this fucking smoke who block my LOS and crappy accuracy I can face even 50 AMX-38. If their drivers don't know where to fire, I'm sure I will survive and kill all of them.
I'm a nice guy and I will tell you where to aim (the obvious place only i'm not this nice  :P )
First, from front. Guess what? the huge optic device on the top f the cuppola. 0 armor never 0% crit damage. I perfected almost all AMX38 from front with that.
Second weakspot, from right side. Aim at the tool box. 0 armor, 0 crit with 0% dmg.

DeathByDribbling #19 Posted 06 January 2012 - 11:56 AM

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I played 2 games in this (fully upgraded using free xp), first I was top tank and like others said I eventually killed some D2's and a 38T, then got into a slug fest with 2 enemy AMX 38's.  This was still going on with very little effect by which time our team capped.  Second I was not top and tank drove very slowly then got destroyed in one shot.  Didn't have a 3rd game, free xp's my way past it.

Volcano #20 Posted 06 January 2012 - 12:09 PM

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View Postklesk, on 05 January 2012 - 11:46 PM, said:

French tanks are WEIRD as hell... in low tiers they are super-armored, slow and they have weak guns...
And in high tiers they have no armor, they are super-fast and they have great guns with autoloaders...

I think... French tank designers used acid.
You know what ? I think you're not totally wrong when you tell that ^^ But you should also think that WoT is a game and that it doesn't totally reflects the reality, otherwise we should be able to use the hull-mounted 75mm gun of the B1 heavy tank or the small turret-mounted gun of the M3 Lee ;)




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