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The problem of the EBR:s

WV EBR Wheelies nerf buf

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BoGustavus #1 Posted 05 June 2020 - 11:40 AM

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The Wheeled Vehicles, EBRs, bring a lot of action and pace to World of Tanks that wasn't there before making it appear more like other modern fast shooter and mabe there for more appealing to new players? They are great mobile scouts who has quite low viewing range but often overcome that by sheer speed. If they coordinate they are an almost unstoppable force. They also bring depth and width to the game and I a lot appreciate the historical fact as armoured cars has been there in history from the very beginning of armoured, motorized warfare.

 

The implementation of the WV however have rendered a lot of players wishing they were unimplemented. Now I know WG have announced they will get nerfed because frontlines are turning into EBR-lines and friends and random games are turning shorter for a lot of players who are getting shot up early on in a battle. These players will feel like they lost even if the game is actually won 10 minutes later!

 

Problem 1, speed

WV are so fast its very hard to hit them. In other online games this can be negated to some extent through area attacks. In World of Tanks thats HE-shells whose splash radius maybe need a big buff to counter the fact that they almost allways are fired from slow reloading guns. This would make WV a more viable target also taking some of the arty-heat of the heavy's and TD. Or maybe just make the paper thin armour of them protect the crew less? This would force the VW to go into hiding more often giving traditional scouts a bigger role too.

 

Problem 2, hp

WV are very low weight but still have almost the same hp as meds and lights, up to three times more than the heavier SPG:s. Would it make more sense if they had the same hp as an SPG? Both classes depend very little on their hp in their style but SPG just by sheer size baby should have a higher hp than the WV.

 

Problem 3, hitbox/wheels

We all know this one. Its harder to hit a WV in a way that makes it take damage than tanks. This is just crazy and needs fixing regardless of buffs and nerfs.

 

Problem 4, mobility

World of Tanks maps have all sorts of terrain from hard roads to soft swamps. A light vehicle with only four small access points the the ground should really struggle on soft terrain and have a much harder time passing tank obstacles. 

 

Problem 5, autocorrect if flipped

Come on, either implement for all tanks or make the WV-drivers have to look where they are going just as every body else are. The all tanks option here is of course the boring one, keeping an eye on the road up ahead is any drivers responsability!

 

Problem 6, crew/modules changes on sandbox

OK, I know sandbox is a testing ground but I still want to mention it here. If the WV are nerfed it feels like all of that and more can be overcome by the abilities of the new modules. The lighter the tanks, the more useful the new modules mechanics feels.

 

Conclution:

If the WV have their hp lowered and their mobility on softer terrains lowered, they have a more intuitive hitbox and lose the wheel-immortality, get more affected by HE and are forced to look more often ahead where they are dring I dont think the actual gun characteristics or the viewing range etc doesn't need to be buffed at all. Instead they will be turned into propper glass-scouts with quite high demands on skill that sacrifices everything for speed, just as a small, light and fast vehicle credibly should!



qpranger #2 Posted 05 June 2020 - 11:51 AM

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Wheeled vehicles in War Thunder.

Clown cars in World of Tanks.



mpf1959 #3 Posted 05 June 2020 - 12:11 PM

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The problem of the EBR:s

: existance.

Alina_Puscau #4 Posted 05 June 2020 - 12:16 PM

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Agreed on all points. The need to counter EBR's with other EBR's at start of game, often in an autoaim circling contest only adds to the tragedy!

Sirebellus #5 Posted 05 June 2020 - 12:30 PM

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I played a TX game yesterday with 5 EBRs on one side and 4 on the other (both sides had platoons of 3)... it was ridiculous, the rest of the teams hardly needed have bother playing, all slow turning tanks (turretless TDs, SPGs) had no chance of participating in the game and were destroyed in the first two minutes...

They put me off playing in T9 and T10 vehicles

saxsan4 #6 Posted 05 June 2020 - 12:31 PM

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No issue I see, the only thing I would change is that their accuracy in rapid mode should be much worse, but apart form that they are balanced,  think people just dot like change, change is good for the game and I love my ebrs

 

giving them the same hp as sag would ruin them, they will always be a 1 shot, very boring to play then


Edited by saxsan4, 05 June 2020 - 12:31 PM.


Kdingo #7 Posted 05 June 2020 - 12:36 PM

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I would like them to add a toyota supra, mazda rx 7 with roof mounted 30mm avenger autocannons.
Off course with proper pimped skins, neon lights and nos.

GodTank2 #8 Posted 05 June 2020 - 01:46 PM

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EBR has 1.3k hp which is the lowest HP at tier 10 ( except clickers ofc ). Also you mentioned mobility twice.

Inappropriate_noob #9 Posted 05 June 2020 - 01:50 PM

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View PostKdingo, on 05 June 2020 - 12:36 PM, said:

I would like them to add a toyota supra, mazda rx 7 with roof mounted 30mm avenger autocannons.
Off course with proper pimped skins, neon lights and nos.

Sounds fun, how much££££:D

12:54 Added after 4 minute

View PostGalan7891, on 05 June 2020 - 01:28 PM, said:

Clicker got killed.Clicker cries on the forums..Boo-f*****g -hoo.

Lol the hate is real, who hates who more though the arty or the wheelies?

I have to admit I cannot drive them, way way too fast for m very slow reactions, if I don't end up going inn a circle I end up trying to climb a tree in one, the jump pretty well though.



UserZer00 #10 Posted 05 June 2020 - 02:02 PM

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They can leave them as they are as long as they provide all players with PCs capable of rendering them correctly as they move or upgrade their servers to give priority to reporting their correct positions.

I'm tired of them just suddenly appearing and then having to try to determine how much I have to aim in front of them so the game will consider it a hit as opposed to where it is logical to aim

Edited by UserZer00, 05 June 2020 - 02:18 PM.


nc30_guy #11 Posted 05 June 2020 - 02:04 PM

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The game was never designed to have these vehicles within it this is where the main problems stem from.

Kdingo #12 Posted 05 June 2020 - 02:07 PM

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View PostInappropriate_noob, on 05 June 2020 - 01:50 PM, said:

Sounds fun, how much££££:D.

 

I think the starting price is 1 soul, if its a pure virgin soul you get the benny hill theme as a horn for free on top.



Thejagdpanther #13 Posted 05 June 2020 - 02:13 PM

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View Postsaxsan4, on 05 June 2020 - 12:31 PM, said:

No issue I see, the only thing I would change is that their accuracy in rapid mode should be much worse, but apart form that they are balanced,  think people just dot like change, change is good for the game and I love my ebrs

 

giving them the same hp as sag would ruin them, they will always be a 1 shot, very boring to play then


Ofc you dont see any issue, only the ebr75 boosted your wr of your tier 8 by 4-5% points.

Wheelie are super fine.

k


Edited by Thejagdpanther, 05 June 2020 - 02:13 PM.


Shadowiko #14 Posted 05 June 2020 - 02:22 PM

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View Postsaxsan4, on 05 June 2020 - 12:31 PM, said:

No issue I see, the only thing I would change is that their accuracy in rapid mode should be much worse, but apart form that they are balanced,  think people just dot like change, change is good for the game and I love my ebrs

 

giving them the same hp as sag would ruin them, they will always be a 1 shot, very boring to play then

EBR is balanced and good for game starter pack players :D

Surely you meant to say I love dominating enemies in my OP and broken [edited] F1 car?

Posted Image

 

On a serious note though, EBRs have way too many key upsides in one tank (*ahem F1 car) nerfing one or two of this things will make tank infinitely more balanced.

 

How about if you want to drive 95km/h you cant have god level auto aim accuracy? 

How about when tracked you actually slow down? 


Edited by Homer_J, 05 June 2020 - 02:46 PM.
Swearing


tajj7 #15 Posted 05 June 2020 - 02:28 PM

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View PostBoGustavus, on 05 June 2020 - 10:40 AM, said:

Problem 1, speed

WV are so fast its very hard to hit them. In other online games this can be negated to some extent through area attacks. In World of Tanks thats HE-shells whose splash radius maybe need a big buff to counter the fact that they almost allways are fired from slow reloading guns. This would make WV a more viable target also taking some of the arty-heat of the heavy's and TD. Or maybe just make the paper thin armour of them protect the crew less? This would force the VW to go into hiding more often giving traditional scouts a bigger role too.

 

 

They are hard to hit for some people, plenty of people don't have much trouble from my experience and they are typically not the ones complaining on forums. videos etc. they just get on with the game. Plus they are harder to hit with guns that are supposed to be weaker to fast moving targets, buffing those guns to be better against fast moving targets makes no sense from a balance perspective.  

 

The drawbacks of big alpha should generally be poor gun handling and that should particularly manifest itself at longer ranges and against small fast moving targets.  WVs are supposed to be counters to camping TDs, often with big alpha guns that cause trouble to heavies and mediums. (also the same with arty, arty should really struggle to hit them ever) You shouldn't have this big alpha gun that works for all situations and against all enemies.

 

The problem is, because of power creep, people are too used to other lights being weak opponents and easy to hit, it is not supposed to be that way, mobility is supposed to impact ease of aiming, they are supposed to counter arty, big alpha TDs, derpy heavies etc. that move slower, turn their turrets slower etc. etc. Lights used to do that back in the day, but everything in the game has got faster, better, more accurate, more reliable, so you know have WVs that have to be so fast to have a chance at being hard to hit. 

 

Block Quote

 

Problem 2, hp

WV are very low weight but still have almost the same hp as meds and lights, up to three times more than the heavier SPG:s. Would it make more sense if they had the same hp as an SPG? Both classes depend very little on their hp in their style but SPG just by sheer size baby should have a higher hp than the WV.

 

They have the lowest HP on their tiers pretty much whilst in many cases being bigger than some other lights.  

 

SPGs have such low HP because basically their HP is irrelevant most of the game, they never get shot at because they have indirect fire and can hide at the back. WVs are active spotters, their whole purpose is to spot enemies driving ridges and putting themselves at risk. If they had SPG HP, they would be completely useless.

 

The Tier 10 has 1300 HP, the lowest on tier and zero armour, most tier 8 mediums have more health than that.  Most tier 6 heavies now have around 1k HP, and the EBR only has 300 more when it is 4 tiers higher and faces guns with 1k alpha, and most tier 10 meds and heavies can 3/4 shot it, but you want it lower?

 

They would be completely pointless.

 

Block Quote

 

Problem 3, hitbox/wheels

We all know this one. Its harder to hit a WV in a way that makes it take damage than tanks. This is just crazy and needs fixing regardless of buffs and nerfs.

 

It really isn't, it just has a higher ground clearance than most tracked tanks. So people often shoot too low or shots dip low, and there is no hitbox of the hull to hit so they do zero damage and then whine about 'magic wheels', when in reality the mechanic is exactly the same as shooting anything else, if you hit an external module with no armour hitbox behind it, you do no damage but module damage.  

 

As I said if you aim properly, then damaging WVs really is not hard, especially in most tier 9 and 10 heavies and meds, as loads of those have good gun handling.  For example I played a game on Malinovka yesterday, an EBR 90 was dodging around the field trying to spot people and I was about 300m to the side of the EBR on the other side of the water at the typical medium spot and clipped the EBR 90 from full health with my Standard B, 3 shots, 3 damaging hits, done with pre-aiming and predicting, making sure I was aiming at the mid point of the hull not centre-mass. Of course this is not going happen every time, RNG will make even perfect aim miss, but if you are consistent and have tanks with good gun handling and know your shell velocities its really not that hard.

 

Block Quote

 

Problem 4, mobility

World of Tanks maps have all sorts of terrain from hard roads to soft swamps. A light vehicle with only four small access points the the ground should really struggle on soft terrain and have a much harder time passing tank obstacles

 

Probably a fair point, though they do have ground resistances which impacts that stuff and their ground resistances are not very good.

 

For example all the other tier 10 lights have better ground resistances than the EBR 105. 

 

Block Quote

 

Problem 5, autocorrect if flipped

Come on, either implement for all tanks or make the WV-drivers have to look where they are going just as every body else are. The all tanks option here is of course the boring one, keeping an eye on the road up ahead is any drivers responsability!

 

Agree though you can flip and put them on their side and backs, its just harder and would seem logical that all lights were similar.

 

Though generally some sort of re-flipping mechanic would be good for all tanks.  It's just an annoying mechanic that doesn't serve much purpose IMO and there should be a way of getting out of it. 

 

Block Quote

 

Problem 6, crew/modules changes on sandbox

OK, I know sandbox is a testing ground but I still want to mention it here. If the WV are nerfed it feels like all of that and more can be overcome by the abilities of the new modules. The lighter the tanks, the more useful the new modules mechanics feels.

 

Not really sure what you mean here, the new equipment is not as powerful as people make out.

 

Block Quote

 

Conclution:

If the WV have their hp lowered and their mobility on softer terrains lowered, they have a more intuitive hitbox and lose the wheel-immortality, get more affected by HE and are forced to look more often ahead where they are dring I dont think the actual gun characteristics or the viewing range etc doesn't need to be buffed at all. Instead they will be turned into propper glass-scouts with quite high demands on skill that sacrifices everything for speed, just as a small, light and fast vehicle credibly should!

 

Lower their HP anymore and they will become basically useless.

 

Losing more mobility from hits into the wheels fine, that is likely to happen anyway.

 

Block Quote

 Instead they will be turned into propper glass-scouts with quite high demands on skill that sacrifices everything for speed, just as a small, light and fast vehicle credibly should!

 

That is already what they are, they don't have much room to sacrifice anything else, especially as they don't overperform as it is, so you'd have to buff other areas like their firepower to compensate. 

 



Homer_J #16 Posted 05 June 2020 - 02:44 PM

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The problem with this thread is we already have a place to discuss wheeled vehicles.

 

http://forum.worldof...cussion-thread/







Also tagged with WV, EBR, Wheelies, nerf, buf

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