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A Simple Quickfix To Gold Ammo Whiners


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TungstenHitman #1 Posted 27 June 2020 - 04:06 PM

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It's so easy really I'm just sorry I didn't think of it sooner and it would shut up any gold whiners and future threads about it because they wouldn't have any factual basis for it anymore. 

 

How? WG just need to permanently remove the displayed information about what ammo type players get shot with during a battle, and there it is, problem solved.

 

If a player doesn't know what type of ammo they were shot with they can't complain about it can they? and besides, all a player needs to know is that they got shot and need to focus on WHY they got shot and what they can do to get shot less and be more effective etc.

 

And there it is ladies and gentlemen, simple and fast. No need to thank me the answer was obvious to begin with but do buy me beers and gold donations of course.



Alcoholic_Hellhound #2 Posted 27 June 2020 - 04:13 PM

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I once received extremely angry PM goldspammer style, after playing my kanonenJP 105. Guy didnt realize APCR was the standart ammo :D, so I had some fun with him in PMs.

NewForces2142 #3 Posted 27 June 2020 - 05:12 PM

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Sure because it's not like they couldn't hear the frying pan shot when hits the tank. How about you actually learn the weak spots for a change or is it too much?

Balc0ra #4 Posted 27 June 2020 - 05:41 PM

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I'm sure you know, that said info has not been shown all the time. It was added a few years ago. Prior to that you had the damage panel mod that showed ammo type. Or you did see the tracer color or the obvious HEAT impact.

 

The issue then was more basic down to the fact that not everyone knew some tanks had HEAT or APCR as normal ammo. And still raged. Or... they had none of the info above, and still raged "gold spammer" in chat, as I did pen his Maus. Only way for anyone to do that is to press 2. As I did get rage PMs like that daily back in the day not firing a single gold round. So no, it like cheat mods, will just lurk in the background. And be the easy answer when you get taken out. Vs blaming yourself etc. It won't fix a thing. If anything, it staying will just reduce the confusion most already had.

 

 


Edited by Balc0ra, 27 June 2020 - 05:43 PM.


Desyatnik_Pansy #5 Posted 27 June 2020 - 05:48 PM

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View PostTungstenHitman, on 27 June 2020 - 04:06 PM, said:

If a player doesn't know what type of ammo they were shot with they can't complain about it can they? and besides, all a player needs to know is that they got shot and need to focus on WHY they got shot and what they can do to get shot less and be more effective etc.

 

The last thing most players want to do is admit fault with their own actions. If they take a paper tank, park it in full view of 5 Enemy vehicles that they know are there and can see them, they won't actually blame themselves for putting themselves there, it must be something else.



TungstenHitman #6 Posted 27 June 2020 - 05:49 PM

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View PostBalc0ra, on 27 June 2020 - 04:41 PM, said:

I'm sure you know, that said info has not been shown all the time. It was added a few years ago. Prior to that you had the damage panel mod that showed ammo type. Or you did see the tracer color or the obvious HEAT impact.

 

The issue then was more basic down to the fact that not everyone knew some tanks had HEAT or APCR as normal ammo. And still raged. Or... they had none of the info above, and still raged "gold spammer" in chat, as I did pen his Maus. Only way for anyone to do that is to press 2. As I did get rage PMs like that daily back in the day not firing a single gold round. So no, it like cheat mods, will just lurk in the background. And be the easy answer when you get taken out. Vs blaming yourself etc. It won't fix a thing. If anything, it staying will just reduce the confusion most already had.

 

 

 

Yes but since most gold ammo whiners are total noobs that are just using gold ammo as a convenient get out of jail for bad play card I'm guessing they are most all totally clueless to tracers, fizz sounds of HEAT cooking a hole in a tank and anything else associated to ammo types for that matter. So besides the slight tongue in cheek nature of this thread I actually do feel this would work lol. 



fwhaatpiraat #7 Posted 27 June 2020 - 06:12 PM

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Hiding the problem ≠ solving it. The problem is ofcourse the poor balance of (certain) armored vehicles and the advantage that premium ammo and consumables offers at the cost of real money.

'But heat doesn't like space armor'. Indeed, such disadvantages, but without the massive boost of penetration. Let's be honest, the 330 and 340 penetration heat shells are much better than the normal corresponding shells. The lower penetration of tanks like Kranvagn, Tvp and Amx 30 are interesting, but stuff like 277 and 430U laugh at that.

The_Naa #8 Posted 27 June 2020 - 06:25 PM

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View PostTungstenHitman, on 27 June 2020 - 04:06 PM, said:

 

 

And there it is ladies and gentlemen, simple and fast. 

 

17:26 Added after 1 minute

i do agree. with OP



Olias_0f_Sunhillow #9 Posted 27 June 2020 - 06:36 PM

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"I am obliged to". Is my stock answer when questioned about spammo.

Kdingo #10 Posted 27 June 2020 - 07:07 PM

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Sorry but won't change anything. Remember how the situation was prior to damage counter, prior to mods showing those infos?
People just cried gold ammo hacker anyways, its impossible that anyone can beat them without spamming heat or using hax.

Crybabies are natural born paranoid and delusional, nothing can fix that.

TungstenHitman #11 Posted 27 June 2020 - 07:09 PM

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View Postfwhaatpiraat, on 27 June 2020 - 05:12 PM, said:

Hiding the problem ≠ solving it. The problem is ofcourse the poor balance of (certain) armored vehicles and the advantage that premium ammo and consumables offers at the cost of real money.

'But heat doesn't like space armor'. Indeed, such disadvantages, but without the massive boost of penetration. Let's be honest, the 330 and 340 penetration heat shells are much better than the normal corresponding shells. The lower penetration of tanks like Kranvagn, Tvp and Amx 30 are interesting, but stuff like 277 and 430U laugh at that.

 

No it doesn't solve the problem of gold ammo itself it just solves the whining problem lol.

 

So far as the ammo itself goes, many reasons to use and not use it and I think that boils down to experience and knowledge overall. Take my credit grinder the M4 Rev for example. It has both APCR and HEAT as an ammo option with the APCR as standard. Now, if I'm fighting an EBR or something really fast or sniping against a fast tank at long range I'm going to want that APCR all day long right? since it's a rail gun and if I load the gold, in this case HEAT, all I will do is effectively make the situation worse and lose the advantage of that tank standard ammo. Should I play another tank and same deal, vs a rally car or fast moving distant tank and it's an important shot, life or death stuff and my gold ammo is a fast APCR then what was standard on the Rev is not me pressing the 2 key on another tank. So different keys for different locks, and of course, if it's something soft and slow like a papery TD or a player with a papery tank that's become guilty of poking that ridge or sitting that bush too often and is now predictably doing it, I will load a HE and do more damage than any other ammo type, HESH not withstanding, and so it's a case of playing to the situation and using knowledge rather than being ever guilty of spamming gold at least so far as my play style is concerned and I'm sure that's the case with a lot of other players.

 

One thing that also heavily influences moments of gold ammo selection for me is the bloody RNG on penetration. Now, correct me if I'm wrong here guys but I'm assuming that penetration is subjected to +-25% potential too but will tend to conform to within the "inner circle" of those extremities like gun accuracy, rarely finding that extreme outer potential. Anyway, do the math, if lets say I have a gun with 200 pen standard shell and I am aiming at a lower plate of 190 MM effective armor, sloped armor effect not withstanding(for bounces), I am gonna want to be rolling standard RNG on that shells pen! Or I can go and F myself right? Because with 25% RNG I could technically low roll to 150 pen which certainly ain't gonna go through. But if my gold ammo has a value of 250 pen, then, even with a really bad low roll I'm STILL just about going to go through that lower plate like my standard ammo SHOULD HAVE if it wasn't for RNG being so variable. So if it's an important shot and it plays out like the above, I will press that 2 key. 



NekoPuffer_PPP #12 Posted 27 June 2020 - 07:25 PM

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View PostTungstenHitman, on 27 June 2020 - 04:06 PM, said:

How? WG just need to permanently remove the displayed information about what ammo type players get shot with during a battle, and there it is, problem solved.

 

I see your logic with this, but no.

 

People would just scream "GOLDSPAMMER" every time they get penetrated.

 

It would only make it worse.

 


I got a better idea - remove it from top guns.



Nazgarth #13 Posted 27 June 2020 - 10:14 PM

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How will this solve anything, IMO it could just as easily create more "gold ammo whine" because people will not know for certain if they were shot by it or not. Complaints about gold ammo existed way before the damage received tracker was added to the vanilla game. 

no_skill_bob #14 Posted 28 June 2020 - 07:16 AM

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anyone whining about gold ammo in 2020 - stuck in the past, where tanks actually had a proper weakspots and prem ammo had an actual gold price.

i really cant see an issue of so called gold spam, its in the game for credits, so theoretically anyone can spam it all day long, if they want. Most of the gold whiners are playing superheavies without weakspots for regular ammo, they want to be invincible - push w hurp a durp, right click, left click.



ZlatanArKung #15 Posted 28 June 2020 - 08:00 AM

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View Postfwhaatpiraat, on 27 June 2020 - 06:12 PM, said:

Hiding the problem ≠ solving it. The problem is ofcourse the poor balance of (certain) armored vehicles and the advantage that premium ammo and consumables offers at the cost of real money.

'But heat doesn't like space armor'. Indeed, such disadvantages, but without the massive boost of penetration. Let's be honest, the 330 and 340 penetration heat shells are much better than the normal corresponding shells. The lower penetration of tanks like Kranvagn, Tvp and Amx 30 are interesting, but stuff like 277 and 430U laugh at that.

Some tanks are russian some tanks aren't.  So some tanks obviously get higher heat pen.



no_skill_bob #16 Posted 28 June 2020 - 08:17 AM

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View PostZlatanArKung, on 28 June 2020 - 09:00 AM, said:

Some tanks are russian some tanks aren't.  So some tanks obviously get higher heat pen.

highest pen on prem shells are not on russki tanks, the only russki tank in highest pen top is the obj 268 with 395 heat and bobject with 360 heat. the rest are german, murican and china tanks.



trispect #17 Posted 28 June 2020 - 09:14 AM

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It sure is funny how mad some people get when they get shot by prem ammo. For example just this other day I was playing Obj 430U and got HEAT loaded for JP E-100. There was low hp T25 Pilot in the open 400m away and I finished him. After the battle I got rage message from this player complaining that I shot him with HEAT. Like it would matter what ammo I shot at his side of tier 8 paper medium...:rolleyes:

 

10/10 of these cases (rage messages) people are just in denial. They complain that they got destroyed because other player shot them with premium ammo, even though it's always them making mistakes and got outplayed. I don't even remember occasion in my own case where I could complain that I got destroyed only because other player's ammo choice. It's always me making misplays and taking damage as consequence. 


Edited by trispect, 28 June 2020 - 09:18 AM.


UrQuan #18 Posted 28 June 2020 - 09:31 AM

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It won't solve a thing. Gold ammo complains have always existed, even when the complainer clearly was shot by standard ammo/in a position where the ammo didn't matter. Also, too many people equal APCR/HEAT ammo with GOLDSPAM! (even tho plenty of higher tier tanks got APCR as standard ammo & some midtiers got HEAT as standard). Giving it colours to differentiate didn't help those people either.

 

I prefer that the info panel stays, so its easier to help people with questions on why & how they got penned (or not penned) + it helps me to guess what kind of shells/guns they use; helping me with angles in tricky situations. No info-> assume they shoot the Ultimate Shell -> A shell that combines the best qualities of their ammo loadout ( the high pen of APCR, the pen characteristics of HEAT & the overmatch+ normalisation of AP)

 

Removal of the info panel would only lead to more gold ammo complains with even less proof to show for it imo. Because too many people drive their Maus/SConqueror/Defender/Obj 430/Badger in the open & then claim *gold ammo!* for being massacred by the enemy & not their own shoddy positioning.

 

Before the age of the info-panel: KV-4 in trouble
Death comes on my terms, not yours!

Old days, where you had to assume enemies shot the APHEATCR shell & position/angle accordingly. And yes, enemy got mauled by AP


Edited by UrQuan, 28 June 2020 - 09:40 AM.


tajj7 #19 Posted 28 June 2020 - 09:39 AM

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Even if you removed premium ammo (which is a terrible idea in the current meta) people would still moan, I'd imagine a lot of people would go after standard ammo that they felt was too high, people basically are always looking for an excuse why they died or did badly and why people are better than them. 

 

Premium ammo has just for a long time been a go to excuse for that. 

 

The actual balance problem it causes is massively blown out of proportion by the whine about it and a lot of that whine essentially comes from bad loser excuses. 



bikes02 #20 Posted 28 June 2020 - 09:42 AM

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View Postno_skill_bob, on 28 June 2020 - 06:16 AM, said:

anyone whining about gold ammo in 2020 - stuck in the past, where tanks actually had a proper weakspots and prem ammo had an actual gold price.

i really cant see an issue of so called gold spam, its in the game for credits, so theoretically anyone can spam it all day long, if they want. Most of the gold whiners are playing superheavies without weakspots for regular ammo, they want to be invincible - push w hurp a durp, right click, left click.

 

+1






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