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Framerate cap is very instable

max framerate fps cap instable setting option engine config

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MarveII #1 Posted 28 June 2020 - 08:51 AM

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For quite a while now I have been capping my maximum framerate in the engine_config.xml file in order to reduce input lag that happens because of GPU overloading or too high GPU usage. While it is great that there is at least an option to limit FPS in the engine, it doesn't scale well and it's implementation could be improved.

 

At higher maximum framerates the FPS fluctates a lot. You also can't set an exact maximum number. There are increments, larger steps that you need to figure out. For example if I set MaxFramerate = 200, it will cap my fps to 167, but not stable. It will fluctate to above 170 and under 165 which is not ideal. If I set MaxFramerate = 210, it will cap my fps to 200, sometimes a little lower but often it will spike my fps to above 230 which is a scenario I would like to avoid.

 

Why does this cap only work in large steps? It is not ideal for people with high refresh screens, it is impossible to cap fps to 240 or anything around that. I would really like to see a proper FPS cap implementation. It would greatly reduce input lag and benefit the whole playerbase. Why was this option not implemented before with the engine upgrades of the last years? It is a very important setting in my opinion and a lot's of games have it.



Pansenmann #2 Posted 28 June 2020 - 09:44 AM

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I have no problem using vsync, that way the Game is in sync with the Display at 60 Hz.

I am pretty sure you can force an fps lock Like this via gpu drivers

 

PS: you should add Info where and what that engine_config.xml is as I have never heard that before.

 

PPS: is that Something for the tech corner of Forums?


Edited by Pansenmann, 28 June 2020 - 09:46 AM.


MarveII #3 Posted 28 June 2020 - 10:00 AM

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It is in the "res" folder. External FPS limiters add extra input lag over engine fps limiters.

Pansenmann #4 Posted 28 June 2020 - 10:10 AM

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Input lag...
Interesting, I only heard that regarding quake champions and never thought it to be an issue with a slow game Like WoT

Can you measure that input lag?


NekoPuffer_PPP #5 Posted 28 June 2020 - 10:11 AM

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I play with no fps cap when I want no input delay... 300+ FPS, on the SD client.



qpranger #6 Posted 28 June 2020 - 10:20 AM

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Always had Vsync at 60 Hz, see zero reason for more FPS in such kind of games.

NekoPuffer_PPP #7 Posted 28 June 2020 - 10:27 AM

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View Postqpranger, on 28 June 2020 - 10:20 AM, said:

Always had Vsync at 60 Hz, see zero reason for more FPS in such kind of games.

 

Even playing on a 75Hz display, the difference between 75fps and 300fps when aiming at, for example, EBRs, is night and day.



qpranger #8 Posted 28 June 2020 - 10:40 AM

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View PostNekoPuffer_PPP, on 28 June 2020 - 12:27 PM, said:

 

Even playing on a 75Hz display, the difference between 75fps and 300fps when aiming at, for example, EBRs, is night and day.

 

No issues with arty :)



Kdingo #9 Posted 28 June 2020 - 11:03 AM

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View PostPansenmann, on 28 June 2020 - 10:10 AM, said:

Input lag...
Interesting, I only heard that regarding quake champions and never thought it to be an issue with a slow game Like WoT

Can you measure that input lag?

 

You probably can, but normally you just "feel" a delay. It varies from game to game, one reason why i started to avoid triple buffering.

Radeon anti lag option however does a great job at some games to even remove input lag on atrocious 30fps titles.



NekoPuffer_PPP #10 Posted 28 June 2020 - 11:04 AM

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View Postqpranger, on 28 June 2020 - 10:40 AM, said:

No issues with arty :)

 

In fact there are issues!

 

If you're using trajectory view while playing arty, and you're playing with no frame limiter (and getting like 300fps), it makes the aiming movement of your mouse very slow.

 

It's a bug, and the only time when you need a frame limiter just to play normally.



Pansenmann #11 Posted 28 June 2020 - 11:49 AM

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View PostKdingo, on 28 June 2020 - 11:03 AM, said:

 

You probably can, but normally you just "feel" a delay. It varies from game to game, one reason why i started to avoid triple buffering.

Radeon anti lag option however does a great job at some games to even remove input lag on atrocious 30fps titles.

 

triple buffering is a completely different topic iirc.

 

by input lag I understood input devices signal delay.

not perceived delay caused by not or "late" calculated frames

 

(I think I have seen somewhere how much time the client actually needs to calculate a frame

and what developers have to take into account to not let the framerate drop below a certain threshold but that might also have been a different game)

 

 

 

View PostNekoPuffer_PPP, on 28 June 2020 - 11:04 AM, said:

 

In fact there are issues!

 

If you're using trajectory view while playing arty, and you're playing with no frame limiter (and getting like 300fps), it makes the aiming movement of your mouse very slow.

 

It's a bug, and the only time when you need a frame limiter just to play normally.

 

That is indeed interesting, never heard of that issue.

When I disable vsync I only get like 140-170 fps  with HD client and everything on max.

Might try SD client later the evening.

(The game client does not have an FPS hardcap like for example DOOM has? )



qpranger #12 Posted 28 June 2020 - 11:50 AM

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View PostNekoPuffer_PPP, on 28 June 2020 - 01:04 PM, said:

 

In fact there are issues!

 

If you're using trajectory view while playing arty, and you're playing with no frame limiter (and getting like 300fps), it makes the aiming movement of your mouse very slow.

 

It's a bug, and the only time when you need a frame limiter just to play normally.

 



NekoPuffer_PPP #13 Posted 28 June 2020 - 12:00 PM

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View PostPansenmann, on 28 June 2020 - 11:49 AM, said:

(The game client does not have an FPS hardcap like for example DOOM has? )

 

I don't think I've ever seen it go past 500, and that's in the loading screens. Correct me if I'm wrong.



Pansenmann #14 Posted 28 June 2020 - 12:55 PM

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reading up on the issue
gets me to the conclusion that the best is to play (the game) with uncapped fps at fullscreen (not windowed or borderless)
and not use wireless devices for input.



MarveII #15 Posted 28 June 2020 - 01:03 PM

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World of tanks has an in-game FPS limit of 1000 which is plenty. In-garage FPS limit is 60.

 

Uncapped FPS is bad because if GPU utilization is at or very close to 100% it can't keep up with the CPU and introduces massive amount of input lag. That is why a properly working in-game FPS limiter would be great.

 

Input lag can be measured with high refresh rate cameras, for example you take a 1000 FPS camera, point it at the screen and calculate the delay between pressing a button, and the pixels changing accordingly on the screen. 1000 FPS means every frame is one miliseconds.



Kdingo #16 Posted 28 June 2020 - 01:36 PM

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View PostPansenmann, on 28 June 2020 - 11:49 AM, said:

 

triple buffering is a completely different topic iirc.

 

by input lag I understood input devices signal delay.

not perceived delay caused by not or "late" calculated frames

 

(I think I have seen somewhere how much time the client actually needs to calculate a frame

and what developers have to take into account to not let the framerate drop below a certain threshold but that might also have been a different game)

 

 

One big issue regarding input lag while using vsync are certain games that have a horrible inconsistent frame times.

Kinda like trying to switch gears in a non sync manual without syncing the revs. You end up feeling like the press of a button has the same effect then watching the server reticle move with its usual delay.

Usually a work around solution is to disable vsync and use a fps limiter to minimize tearing (if this is what someone has issues with). However the "problem" varies heavily as well coded games don´t usually have this problem. Never experienced this sort of delay/input lag in wot, the only delay you have is online part which is to be expected.



arthurwellsley #17 Posted 28 June 2020 - 01:46 PM

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View PostNekoPuffer_PPP, on 28 June 2020 - 09:11 AM, said:

 

I play with no fps cap when I want no input delay... 300+ FPS, on the SD client.

 

Thanks for this picture. I have used the information to set my FPS at 231 as an experiment. Previously I have had no limit. I have a 144Hz screen and play on maximum HD settings. I am interested to see if this makes a difference.



24doom24 #18 Posted 28 June 2020 - 02:02 PM

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I don't see what's so good about limiting your FPS to 60. 165hz is soo much better. 

Pansenmann #19 Posted 28 June 2020 - 02:35 PM

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View Post24doom24, on 28 June 2020 - 02:02 PM, said:

I don't see what's so good about limiting your FPS to 60. 165hz is soo much better. 

 

since my display can't do more than 60Hz anyways

I use it to: reduce tearing in some games

and the GPU rarely goes above 40% load (1440p) when playing wot so the whole system is

producing less heat = no fan noise


Edited by Pansenmann, 28 June 2020 - 02:35 PM.


Gruff_ #20 Posted 28 June 2020 - 04:53 PM

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I'll just sit here at 30-50 fps!

Edited by Gruff_, 28 June 2020 - 04:53 PM.






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