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Why EBR and Progetto can be nerfed but Defender - niet?


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oBmg #1 Posted 19 July 2020 - 07:19 PM

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Panhard EBR 75 (FL 10) and Progetto M35 mod 46, 2 very powerfull Premium tanks which people purchased for money, under contract, are to be nerfed by seller of the same  product.

 

This precedent of changing (to worse) features of the product that has been defined  and selled for money is even more strange in a light of the fact that the epitome of OP Premium tank, a  Object 252U Defender with tier X armor, which was crticised in same manner by players for years, will  obviously never be nerfed.

 

So Soviet one  cant be nerfed? But French ad Italian can?

 

 

EDITED..

 

Europeans..remember times they insulted us with Defender,and never changed it.They even acted as insulted by rage on EU,so decided they will "not sell Defender on EU"anymore.

,but never changed the Defender itself.

Now you have it back.Never changed.

 

But they will change lower race premium tanks, they will "obey" your democratic plea to do so.

...........

Allow them to  exploit you.

Allow them to think they are intellectually superior to you .

Allow them to lough at you.

 

 


Edited by oBmg, 19 July 2020 - 09:01 PM.


TheNightFox #2 Posted 19 July 2020 - 07:26 PM

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You're a bit behind with the news, and Stalin pictures don't help you look more up to date either.

Edited by TheNightFox, 19 July 2020 - 07:26 PM.


oBmg #3 Posted 19 July 2020 - 07:27 PM

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View PostTheNightFox, on 19 July 2020 - 07:26 PM, said:

You're a bit behind with the news, and Stalin pictures don't help you look more up to date either.

 

So there will  be no nerf of Progetto and EBR?

 

Or there will be nerf of Defender to?

 

What is it that happened in the bright past news that I didnt noticed?


Edited by oBmg, 19 July 2020 - 07:32 PM.


Desyatnik_Pansy #4 Posted 19 July 2020 - 07:32 PM

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At the moment we don't even know if the nerfs or the effective buffs to the EBR 75/Progetto 46 Are actually coming, but point aside, WG Felt they could get away with this because it's more of a mechanic nerf than a true nerf. They decided to remove rammers from all autoreloaders, but a rammer is a piece of equipment, not part of a tank's actual statistics. It just go happens that y'know, pretty much everyone uses a rammer. In the case of the wheelies it is arguably more of a true nerf since it is actually nerfing a stat (surely if I looked for it in the scripts, there is a line to define what the speed is after wheel damage) but still you're not truly losing much. It's not like losing 20mm on armour, or 0.02 On accuracy and so on. It's just mechanics that happen to affect these vehicles.

 

The Defender unfortunately doesn't exactly have some unique mechanic to it that you can modify without changing the tank statistics, and even if it did, the backlash from the attempted nerfs to the EBR 75/Progetto 46 Are obvious and unfortunately led to them effectively buffing both vehicles (already the top dogs at Tier VIII) with the updated version of the changes, so the Defender would probably follow the same treatment. 



OniichanSenpai #5 Posted 19 July 2020 - 07:34 PM

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Defender is a pretty bad tank, the gun handling sucks and against Tier 9 and 10 its armor is butter. There is a reason Defender players primarily drive it in Frontlines.

oBmg #6 Posted 19 July 2020 - 07:39 PM

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View PostDesyatnik_Pansy, on 19 July 2020 - 07:32 PM, said:

At the moment we don't even know if the nerfs or the effective buffs to the EBR 75/Progetto 46 Are actually coming, but point aside, WG Felt they could get away with this because it's more of a mechanic nerf than a true nerf. They decided to remove rammers from all autoreloaders, but a rammer is a piece of equipment, not part of a tank's actual statistics. It just go happens that y'know, pretty much everyone uses a rammer. In the case of the wheelies it is arguably more of a true nerf since it is actually nerfing a stat (surely if I looked for it in the scripts, there is a line to define what the speed is after wheel damage) but still you're not truly losing much. It's not like losing 20mm on armour, or 0.02 On accuracy and so on. It's just mechanics that happen to affect these vehicles.

 

The Defender unfortunately doesn't exactly have some unique mechanic to it that you can modify without changing the tank statistics, and even if it did, the backlash from the attempted nerfs to the EBR 75/Progetto 46 Are obvious and unfortunately led to them effectively buffing both vehicles (already the top dogs at Tier VIII) with the updated version of the changes, so the Defender would probably follow the same treatment. 

 

Its like you buy a car, and than manufacturer changes  car so it can not have previous installation of the part of equipment, let say a turbo charger, and you must return car so they deinstal you turbocharger.Now have it...enjoy what you payed for....??????

It is a change of the end characteristics of the product(car) bought under contract.

 

IF Progetto didnt  had  rammer installation ability intially, its stats will be worse, and less people will buy it by now.

 

Thus,removing feature that contributed to popularity of selling product is a scam.


Edited by oBmg, 19 July 2020 - 07:43 PM.


saxsan4 #7 Posted 19 July 2020 - 07:40 PM

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View PostoBmg, on 19 July 2020 - 06:27 PM, said:

 

So there will  be no nerf of Progetto and EBR?

 

Or there will be nerf of Defender to?

 

What is it that happened in the bright past news that I didnt noticed?


Progetto is getting dpm buff to incorporate the rammer and an extra equipment slot aka a double buff

 

EBR 75 is not being affected by the nerfs thankfully

 

WG are listening to us

18:40 Added after 0 minute

View PostOniichanSenpai, on 19 July 2020 - 06:34 PM, said:

Defender is a pretty bad tank, the gun handling sucks and against Tier 9 and 10 its armor is butter. There is a reason Defender players primarily drive it in Frontlines.


yes, I have it expecting OP tank and its very hard to use except in point blank range or against noobs

 

Mutant is MUCH better


Edited by saxsan4, 19 July 2020 - 07:54 PM.


TheNightFox #8 Posted 19 July 2020 - 07:47 PM

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View PostoBmg, on 19 July 2020 - 07:19 PM, said:

Panhard EBR 75 (FL 10) and Progetto M35 mod 46, 2 very powerfull Premium tanks which people purchased for money, under contract, are to be nerfed by seller of the same  product.

 

This precedent of changing (to worse) stats of the product that has been defined  and selled for money is even more strange in a light of the fact that the epitome of OP Premium tank, a  Object 252U Defender with tier X armor, which was crticised in same manner by players for years, will  obviously never be nerfed.

 

So Soviet one  cant be nerfed? But French ad Italian can?

 

 

 

 

 

 

saxsan4 gave you the answer. if anything, Progetto is getting a buff. Stalin is rolling in his grave, I suppose.



Desyatnik_Pansy #9 Posted 19 July 2020 - 07:48 PM

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View PostoBmg, on 19 July 2020 - 07:39 PM, said:

Its like you buy a car, and than manufacturer changes  car so it can not have previous installation of the part of equipment, let say a turbo charger, and you must return car so they deinstal you turbocharger.Now have it...enjoy what you payed for....??????

It is a change of the end characteristics of the product(car) bought under contract.

 

IF Proigetto didnt  have rammer ability intially, its stats will be worse, and less people will buy it by now.

 

Thus,removing feature that contributed to popularity of selling product is a scam.

 

I'm not planning on trying to refute that, but the point being is that's probably why they felt they could maybe get away with it. They weren't directly changing the actual tank statistics (contrary to the bold part), so they probably thought it was passable. The huge backlash has proven it was not.

 

To perhaps try to explain it better, let's say, they remove Binocs from every TD In the game; including the Premiums. Your tank is not actually getting nerfed as no stats are being changed, but for many TDs that work effectively with Binocs (i.e Strvs) you are seeing a fairly significant hit to your tank's performance. 

 

View Postsaxsan4, on 19 July 2020 - 07:40 PM, said:

WG are listening to us

 

WG Aren't listening to us. IIRC Someone mentioned something like a 70-page thread about these changes on the Russian forums, if it wasn't for that they wouldn't have likely given a toss about the EU/NA Threads on the same subject.

 


Edited by Desyatnik_Pansy, 19 July 2020 - 07:50 PM.


_Signal_ #10 Posted 19 July 2020 - 07:56 PM

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View PostTheNightFox, on 19 July 2020 - 06:26 PM, said:

You're a bit behind with the news, and Stalin pictures don't help you look more up to date either.

This is the new version:

 



TheNightFox #11 Posted 19 July 2020 - 07:58 PM

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View Post_Signal_, on 19 July 2020 - 07:56 PM, said:

This is the new version:

 

 

Looks like the next CW reward. Object Bearminator (e)


Edited by TheNightFox, 19 July 2020 - 07:59 PM.


oBmg #12 Posted 19 July 2020 - 08:03 PM

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Europeans..remember times they insulted us with Defender,and never changed it.They even acted as insulted by rage on EU,so decided they will "not sell Defender on EU"anymore.

,but never changed the Defender itself.

Now you have it back.Never changed.

 

But they will change lower race premium tanks, they will "obey" your democratic plea to do so.

...........

Allow them to  exploit you.

Allow them to think they are intellectually superior to you .

Allow them to lough at you.

I will not.


Edited by oBmg, 19 July 2020 - 08:18 PM.


DaniulSims #13 Posted 19 July 2020 - 08:09 PM

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View PostoBmg, on 19 July 2020 - 09:03 PM, said:

Europeans..remember times they insulted us with Defender,and never changed it.They even acted as insulted by rage on EU,so hey decided will "not sell iDefender on EU"

,but never change the Defender itself.

Now you have it back.Never changed.

 

But they will change lower race premium tanks.And now they will ovey your democratic plea to do so.

...........

Allow them to be exploit you.

Allow them to think you are stupid.

Allow them to lough at you.

I will not.

This was, in all honesty, a crige thing to read.



Corrupted_Pling #14 Posted 19 July 2020 - 08:09 PM

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ebr pretty much ruined light tank gameplay so I have no objection to the nerf and if i had anything to do with it I would nerf it more

 

As for progetto they just stoping the rammer so my reload is higher but meeh i can live with that as the tank is so much better then its tech tree counterpart


Edited by Corrupted_Pling, 19 July 2020 - 08:09 PM.


oBmg #15 Posted 19 July 2020 - 09:05 PM

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View PostCorrupted_Pling, on 19 July 2020 - 08:09 PM, said:

ebr pretty much ruined light tank gameplay so I have no objection to the nerf and if i had anything to do with it I would nerf it more

 

As for progetto they just stoping the rammer so my reload is higher but meeh i can live with that as the tank is so much better then its tech tree counterpart

 

EBR 75 is extremly fun tank.That is why and how it was selled to us, for real money.For fun.

 

But its WR is very average.I have 45 % win rate despite enjoying it.So it lowers my stats.

 

I am not sure does people which criticise EBR actually play it and own  it?.

This wehicle is blind as a bat, view range barely 390 m with all enhancements and  skills.

It requiers high skill to be played, unlike stright from the factory OP Defender

 

So what bothers me is they nerf  EBR that requires high skill to be influential in the battles, but not Defender which is OP by passive tier X armor even in the hands of noob.


Edited by oBmg, 19 July 2020 - 09:09 PM.


StronkiTonki #16 Posted 19 July 2020 - 09:08 PM

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Cause it's Rashan!

Balc0ra #17 Posted 19 July 2020 - 09:11 PM

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View PostoBmg, on 19 July 2020 - 07:27 PM, said:

 

So there will  be no nerf of Progetto and EBR?

 

Or there will be nerf of Defender to?

 

What is it that happened in the bright past news that I didnt noticed?

 

No, they won't. ERB is not affected by the new physics mechanic on damaged wheels anymore. And the Progetto will still lose his rammed. But... get a DPM buff as if he had a rammer mounted. So next patch if you put vents on slot 1, as in a 6% boost vs 5%. Then add the "built-in" rammer. It gets more DPM then it has now. So you can argue it's been buffed due to the new equipment changes. So now you can use the 3rd slot for something else, and still have the same or better DPM and view range like now.  And get more Hitpoints or more top speed. So.. again, it's been buffed if anything. 

 

EBR is still nerfed on CT2, but will be changed on the next test. But... again the Progetto was not the only premium that lost his rammer, but the only one people went mad about here. Premiums on tier 4 and lower that could mount it would lose it too. But now will be buffed to get their DPM up to if they had one mounted as well. 

 

 


Edited by Balc0ra, 19 July 2020 - 09:14 PM.


oBmg #18 Posted 19 July 2020 - 09:14 PM

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View PostStronkiTonki, on 19 July 2020 - 09:08 PM, said:

Cause it's Rashan!

 

This WG  people are so harmfully biased.

 

Harmfully , for us, but  mostly for themselves.

 

They could have had entire world conquered with this magnificant game.

 

But  they made most famous tanks of all time,German tanks , support acting roles from the start, made and positioned Germans in a way  to exhalt WW2 strategic triumph over Germany on a childish tactical level orchestration,  in which fact of German tanks  in reality obliterating Russians in 3-5  to 1 ratio. was compoensated by  making  caricatures of Germans, and subsequently by the law of "balance" of almost all nation except Soviet.

 

Italians and French were  neutral  enough for them,so they allowed some fine tanks like  Progetto and EBR, but here to they succumbed to their nature over time-nothing can be better than Russian.

 

By this strategic fault from the start this game has been  restricted ,their player base and  their market was shrinking back to CIS,  and will eventually be played only there .

 

 


Edited by oBmg, 19 July 2020 - 09:43 PM.


ONE77ZERO13 #19 Posted 19 July 2020 - 09:14 PM

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afaik Progetto and EBR premiums are being buffed to negate the effects of the overall nerfs

 

but i could be wrong and they already walked that back again


Edited by ONE77ZERO13, 19 July 2020 - 09:14 PM.


24doom24 #20 Posted 19 July 2020 - 09:25 PM

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Probably because it's not even that good? All it has is hull armour. That's it. Everything else is on par or worse than other tech tree tanks. The triple arta meta makes playing heavies unbearable anyway. 

 

The Progetto and EBR are far more flexible and can carry much easier than a defender. A defender is good for a tomato noob to roll around in and bounce one or two shots in before dying. 

 

That being said, WG had a full on 'bruh moment' and ended up buffing the EBR and Progetto. 


Edited by 24doom24, 19 July 2020 - 09:26 PM.





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