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WG what have you done with the T7 Combat Car and Light Mk. VIC?

T7 Combat Car Light Mk. VIC Bug Nerf?

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Denton_0451 #1 Posted 24 October 2020 - 10:40 PM

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So I was busy today the whole day and just had time to get the daily mission for Tankrewards. I logged on and joined a battle in the T7 Combat car that was one of my favourite low tier tanks. Sadly I had to realize that either it was broken recently or was stealth nerfed (no patchnotes indicated a change in the vehicles) with it's MG brother,  the Light Mk. VIC alongside. Previously if you held down the fire button the gun fired until it ran out of ammo, like in the following video at 0:59:


 

Today though both tanks had to wait 0,5-1 seconds between the 5 round bursts killing off the fun and effectiveness of the tanks as the DPM was decreased and you have to stay in the open for longer if you want to empty the whole magazine on a target. Here is a video comparison of the current shooting mechanic:

 


Last time I've played with it a few weeks ago the machine gun worked like it was supposed to do so I suspect something happened in the patch 1.10.1. Other autocannon wielding tanks might be affected too, I haven't had the time to check those.



Balc0ra #2 Posted 24 October 2020 - 11:42 PM

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Not played mine for ages. But going by the tracers vs the sound. It seems to send a stream of shells still on that clip, even after the sound stops. But updates the ammo 5 shells at the time vs on each one. 

matsc #3 Posted 25 October 2020 - 12:41 AM

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When winding down after an evening of WoT me and a platoonmate ususally play 1-3 Leopard matches.

My platoonmate noticed after the patch that there was someting unusual with the autocannon.

A small delay where it usually was none.

 

One match we both shot our full clip at nothing and it felt like usual.

A little later when we shot at live targets the delay was back.

I felt that it was really noticable when firing (and hitting) blind at a bush.

 

We belive that it is some kind of lag on the server.

/edit for clarification


Edited by matsc, 25 October 2020 - 12:43 AM.


Denton_0451 #4 Posted 25 October 2020 - 12:30 PM

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View PostBalc0ra, on 24 October 2020 - 11:42 PM, said:

Not played mine for ages. But going by the tracers vs the sound. It seems to send a stream of shells still on that clip, even after the sound stops. But updates the ammo 5 shells at the time vs on each one. 


I was suspecting a sound bug too. If I have some free time I will search for a full magdump from an older version and compare the timing with the current one.
On the other hand the quarter circle reload indicator is different in the two videos posted. In the older version it's green only for a split second, while in my video it's green for way longer, corresponding with the sound timing.

 

View Postmatsc, on 25 October 2020 - 12:41 AM, said:

When winding down after an evening of WoT me and a platoonmate ususally play 1-3 Leopard matches.

My platoonmate noticed after the patch that there was someting unusual with the autocannon.

A small delay where it usually was none.

 

One match we both shot our full clip at nothing and it felt like usual.

A little later when we shot at live targets the delay was back.

I felt that it was really noticable when firing (and hitting) blind at a bush.

 

We belive that it is some kind of lag on the server.

/edit for clarification

 

When I've tried the Light Mk. VIC to see if it has the same issue I was shooting the second I've reloaded at the beginning of the battle without seeing any enemy tanks and it still had the same problem.

 



Denton_0451 #5 Posted 03 November 2020 - 05:31 PM

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I finally found a video with a full magdump from the previous patch. The results are really sad, the time to empty the magazine of the T7 CC was increased by 3 seconds without any mention in the patchnotes.



24doom24 #6 Posted 03 November 2020 - 08:18 PM

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can confirm T7 car is nerfed. What the hell WG?

 

Hopefully it's just a bug. 



Denton_0451 #7 Posted 04 November 2020 - 03:22 PM

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Video proof of the Light Mk. VIC being nerfed as well. I'm pretty sure most of the machinegun/autocannon vehicles were nerfed this way, but I don't have time or all the vehicles to test them out one by one.



Balc0ra #8 Posted 04 November 2020 - 03:57 PM

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So I got curious and took mine out for a spin. It's not a sound issue more so than a visual issue. As the sound cuts off along with the hits, but the visual client side wall of shells is the part that is inconsistent vs the server shells and sound. As when I clipped a TKS 20, the hits came in waves of 5 with time between vs as a constant stream of hits like it was visually. It did fire in shorts burst before too, with like 0.01 seconds between each burst if you did hold the button down, not half a second like it seems like now. 

 

View PostDenton_0451, on 04 November 2020 - 03:22 PM, said:

Video proof of the Light Mk. VIC being nerfed as well. I'm pretty sure most of the machinegun/autocannon vehicles were nerfed this way, but I don't have time or all the vehicles to test them out one by one.

 

So it was recently? According to stats, the DPM etc is exactly the same as before between those two versions tho. But it could have been a mechanic change to low tier guns that affected them too. But even tho the T7CC and Light Vic are gift tanks. Some still bought it with real money, and as per the norm they should not be affected by such changes. But there is no mention of such a change in the patch notes that should affect the T7CC etc either. 

 

 


Edited by Balc0ra, 04 November 2020 - 03:57 PM.


Denton_0451 #9 Posted 04 November 2020 - 04:09 PM

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View PostBalc0ra, on 04 November 2020 - 03:57 PM, said:

So I got curious and took mine out for a spin. It's not a sound issue more so than a visual issue. As the sound cuts off along with the hits, but the visual client side wall of shells is the part that is inconsistent vs the server shells and sound. As when I clipped a TKS 20, the hits came in waves of 5 with time between vs as a constant stream of hits like it was visually. It did fire in shorts burst before too, with like 0.01 seconds between each burst if you did hold the button down, not half a second like it seems like now.

 

It's not just visual, watch the two videos with the comparisons I made, you can see that while I'm still emptying my magazine in version 1.10.1 the other vehicles are happily reloading by then. Both videos have the source linked so you can see that neither of them are sped up.

 

View PostBalc0ra, on 04 November 2020 - 03:57 PM, said:

So it was recently? According to stats, the DPM etc is exactly the same as before between those two versions tho. But it could have been a mechanic change to low tier guns that affected them too. But even tho the T7CC and Light Vic are gift tanks. Some still bought it with real money, and as per the norm they should not be affected by such changes. But there is no mention of such a change in the patch notes that should affect the T7CC etc either.

 

I had no issue with either tanks in September during patch 1.10. I suspect they got broken with the arrival of patch 1.10.1.



Balc0ra #10 Posted 04 November 2020 - 04:25 PM

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View PostDenton_0451, on 04 November 2020 - 04:09 PM, said:

 

It's not just visual, watch the two videos with the comparisons I made, you can see that while I'm still emptying my magazine in version 1.10.1 the other vehicles are happily reloading by then. Both videos have the source linked so you can see that neither of them are sped up.

 

Well, my point was that it's not the sound that' the issue like we first assumed more so than the visual stream of shell's that is like it should be. Hits on the enemy targets are consistent with the sound vs the visuals. So the visuals are the one that's off. But as the hits on the targets are the same, then logically the time to empty the clip is longer as the video did show. Thus since one aspect remains and the other is changed. It could be a bug vs a deliberate change tbh. 

 

More so when the stats differs vs how the tank is. The stat sites has the same stats listed for it on reload and DPM on 1.10.1 as it did on 9.17 and up. And those stats are the same as it is in-game now with a 100% base crew and no equipment. As in 23.01 sec reload and 846 DPM. As it still lists 0.11 as time between shells vs a burst of 5 or even a longer time. So as the stats and the in-game one is inconsistent. I suspect it could be a bug issue vs a hidden nerf. 



Lanrefni #11 Posted 05 November 2020 - 01:44 AM

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pretty sure premiums don't get nerfed. either a bug or some problems with regards to client-server ping, etc.

 

AFAIK, only pz1c got nerfed (for good, frankly) so it can't just shred everything anymore.



stormermp #12 Posted 05 November 2020 - 11:55 AM

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View PostLanrefni, on 05 November 2020 - 12:44 AM, said:

pretty sure premiums don't get nerfed. either a bug or some problems with regards to client-server ping, etc.

 

AFAIK, only pz1c got nerfed (for good, frankly) so it can't just shred everything anymore.

Yea let WG nerf all of the non-soviet tanks..That will surely bring new players and keep the older playing,oh and we need more silent nerfs and changes that nobody asked for.



24doom24 #13 Posted 05 November 2020 - 12:39 PM

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View PostLanrefni, on 05 November 2020 - 12:44 AM, said:

pretty sure premiums don't get nerfed. either a bug or some problems with regards to client-server ping, etc.

 

AFAIK, only pz1c got nerfed (for good, frankly) so it can't just shred everything anymore.

definitely not a ping issue. The T7 combat fires noticeably slower now as I tested it. Must be a bug. 



Denton_0451 #14 Posted 05 November 2020 - 01:31 PM

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View PostLanrefni, on 05 November 2020 - 01:44 AM, said:

either a bug or some problems with regards to client-server ping, etc.

 

It's not a ping issue. I have 30-40 ms ping with no packet loss and have the problem. The second someone official from WG comes here and says they've accidentally messed up something and they will fix it in an upcoming patch I will say it's a bug, until then it's a ninja nerf.

 

View PostLanrefni, on 05 November 2020 - 01:44 AM, said:

AFAIK, only pz1c got nerfed (for good, frankly) so it can't just shred everything anymore.

 

Every autocannon/machinegun vehicle was indirectly nerfed with the HP increase since the magazine size remained the same on them. The extra nerfs for the Pz I C and the Luchs were unnecessary but that's for another topic.



feies_vlad #15 Posted 05 November 2020 - 10:08 PM

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Just as a curiosity, tried the tier 5 leo in training room (and some other lower tiers), the 30 mm gun on the tier 5 leo does exactly that, just fires in groups, and then a small delay, not the whole clip at once it always did without any delay, and there were no mention in the patch notes, like what the actual WG, is this like a intentional permanent change or a bug? I really hope some WG staff can actually clarify this please, thank you. :unsure:

feies_vlad #16 Posted 05 November 2020 - 10:19 PM

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View Post24doom24, on 05 November 2020 - 12:39 PM, said:

definitely not a ping issue. The T7 combat fires noticeably slower now as I tested it. Must be a bug. 

I don't have that tank, but I noticed the same exact thing on the tier 5 leo, one of my fav's to just take out with friends from time to time and have some fun, like, the leo always had the 4 groups x3 shells (12 shells), and it never had a delay betwen each group, you can basically fire all the shells without any delay, since the last patch that is not the case anymore, it just has a delay in between those groups and it's a HUGE change on how the tank actually plays, I really hope it's not a intentional change and just a bug. :(


Edited by feies_vlad, 05 November 2020 - 10:24 PM.


Lanrefni #17 Posted 05 November 2020 - 10:49 PM

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View Poststormermp, on 05 November 2020 - 12:55 PM, said:

Yea let WG nerf all of the non-soviet tanks..That will surely bring new players and keep the older playing,oh and we need more silent nerfs and changes that nobody asked for.

There are no new players. There are either noobs or good players. That kind of reality has been set for the past 3 years. Everyone who cannot adapt to the changes just doesn't belong here and will be destroyed.

With all due respect, Pz. I C was an OP tank. 

Was there supposed to be a fun factor when a platoon of 3 of these went up in your face and then punctured you and 2 other teammates to death? Thankfully, doesn't happen anymore as often.

Block Quote

 The T7 combat fires noticeably slower now as I tested it. Must be a bug. 

 Ok, I haven't played mine recently, so I will take your word for it.

 

Block Quote

 Every autocannon/machinegun vehicle was indirectly nerfed with the HP increase since the magazine size remained the same on them. The extra nerfs for the Pz I C and the Luchs were unnecessary but that's for another topic.

 That is not a secret, sure. Don't care about Luchs because I could just play things like M5A1 Stuart, but Pz I C nerf was definitely needed. That was not fun on the receiving end at all.

 



Balc0ra #18 Posted 05 November 2020 - 10:54 PM

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View Postfeies_vlad, on 05 November 2020 - 10:08 PM, said:

Just as a curiosity, tried the tier 5 leo in training room (and some other lower tiers), the 30 mm gun on the tier 5 leo does exactly that, just fires in groups, and then a small delay, not the whole clip at once it always did without any delay, and there were no mention in the patch notes, like what the actual WG, is this like a intentional permanent change or a bug? I really hope some WG staff can actually clarify this please, thank you. :unsure:

 

That we know was nerfed, and it was announced, tested and implemented. The Luchs has had that gun with the same burst fire since it had +4 MM and faced IS-3's. So when the MM changed 2-3 times and it could even be top tier etc. They increased the time between shots so it takes longer to empty the clip. As the Leo has the same gun, he was affected too as his burst damage was bigger and faster. 

 

That was nerfed along with the Pz 1c etc iirc back in the beginning of the year in patch 1.9 or what it was. As that was a nerf a fair few did ask for. The T67 was hit the same patch, so most called it the anti padder patch. 


Edited by Balc0ra, 05 November 2020 - 10:57 PM.


feies_vlad #19 Posted 05 November 2020 - 11:24 PM

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View PostBalc0ra, on 05 November 2020 - 10:54 PM, said:

That was nerfed along with the Pz 1c etc iirc back in the beginning of the year in patch 1.9 or what it was. As that was a nerf a fair few did ask for. The T67 was hit the same patch, so most called it the anti padder patch. 

Nope, the luchs nerf was in the patch notes way back when all those tanks were nerfed, the tier 5 leo was not in those notes, and it wasn't actually changed (until the last patch for some reason without any patch notes about it). I literally played it like a few weeks before the last patch and it was the same as it always was, but not anymore since the 1.10.1.

I played both Luchs and the tier 5 leo back when many of those german lower tiers were nerffed, and no, leo was NOT changed even tho it has the "same" gun, the time between the shells is still basically the same, but there is a delay between the 4 groups of shells(3). Also, I get that people asked for the luchs nerf, but literally no one said anything about the leo that needs any nerfs (even tho it was not nerfed back at the start of the year)

In the end, my point is that every tank that was fine before the last patch was affected by this unanounced change for the machine guns and autocannons (apart from tanks like luchs and pz1c which had clear nerfs way back at the start of the year).


Edited by feies_vlad, 08 November 2020 - 11:00 AM.


Denton_0451 #20 Posted 06 November 2020 - 05:21 PM

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:bush:
I see WG is nowhere to be found to enlighten us about this issue.




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