Main page

Lorraine is way OP for me. And mine isn't even fully upgraded yet.

I'm grinding all engines before 100mm gun, so I can see what performance increase if any comes from 100mm compared to 90mm.

I just got top engine and I'm already doing as much DpM as my tier 8 heavies, a good third more then my other tier 8 meds.


Now sure it's a glass cannon, which gives it limitations to go along with the ones it's height and lack of gun depression give. Like all glass cannons, if you're not so good at not getting hit while still getting your shots in, then it won't work so well for you. But if you are, then it's OP.

So I don't expect server averages for this tank to be as extraordinary as it has been for me THUS FAR. I might crash and burn every time in the next 100 games, who knows, but I doubt it.

In my opinion Lorraine should be feared when it is attacking because it can do so much dmg in very short time. When I get Lorraine against my Pershing I try to make him to waste his ammo and shoot at him when i get the chance especially when his clip is empty. Pershings armor is pretty good and its turret can bounce shots even from maus if they fail and shoot to the mantlet.

Mike_Hammer, on 20 February 2012 - 03:52 PM, said:

I usually don't drive MT except Type 59, I like HT and LT more. However, playing the type 59 and now the first frog MT, I tends to agree with you.

It's a make or break tank, but with care it's mostly make and that makes it OP (not much, but a little bit). The problem is not the amour it very thin, the problem is the HP pool. You can't one or two shoot it, unless you are a Ob 704/SU 152 or arty, and that makes it OP.

Now, they say the nerf is going to be reduces RoF within the clip, but clip loading time will remain the same. It will give others tanks a break to be able to reload and shoot back, however, it would also mean that it becomes pointless. The quick succession of rounds is the key to the frog line along with speed. I would really have preferred to have lowed the HP pool instead, to maybe a 1000 or less for the Lorraine. Once shoot is mostly dead anyway, so HP is really not that important for the frog game play and still it would would give others tanks a chance against it. The reduces RoF kinda ruins the frog game play, and just make it fast with really no point, unless of cause the nerf is minuscule, but that would defeat the reason for a nerf in the first place!!!

The AMX13 90 at least can still function as scout and arty killer like T50-2, bat-chat will not be nerf however, but that is tie 9 of cause, still I feel bat-chat is OP too IMO.

molan1976, on 06 March 2012 - 11:06 AM, said:

What?!...

It's OP because you can't 1-shoot it?! Are you serious?!

And did you even bother to check the HP pool of other T8 mediums? No, you didn't:

Lorraine 1300
Type 59 1300
T-44 1190
Panther II 1350
Pershing 1350

Only 1 other T8 has less, and 2 have more. And the Lorraine has less than half the frontal armour of all of those tanks, with side/rear also being far thinner. So, if the Lorraine's 1300 HP makes it OP, what does the Panther II's combo of HP and armour does to it? Turns into a battlefield god?

As for "not being 1-shoted", you're conveniently forgeting module damage: any damage to driver, tracks or engine cuts down on the Lorraine's only way to survive, it's speed. And a hit on the ammo cuts clip reload to over 2mns, unless you carry repair kits, which turns the tank into a bigger money sink.

Seriously... "can't 1-shoot it". What next?...

Hammerbolt, on 06 March 2012 - 11:22 AM, said:

The thing is Lorraine can kill everything in its tier simply by trading shots with it. A medium shouldn't be able to do that, it should have to use mobility to gain the advantage. At least for non-tier 9's, that enjoy 1.0 weighted MM.

T-44 has 1300hp also fyi.

Hammerbolt, on 06 March 2012 - 11:22 AM, said:

Lorraine has pen, accuracy and RoF, then speed and dynamics and fair camo value to boot. The cost is armour and reload time of clip only, overall a bit OP, even a player like me that drives and loves it can see that.

If HP pool was reduces, it wouldn't mean much to it anyway, because as you say "module damage: any damage to driver, tracks or engine cuts down on the Lorraine's only way to survive, it's speed. And a hit on the ammo cuts clip reload to over 2mns", so HP pool would have been a good nerf point. However WG will nerf it's RoF within the clip, with kinda defeats it's primary selling point IMO.

Whoever made the argument that the Lorraine is introduced as a ways of punishment for bad teamwork has got it all wrong. Good teamwork of a team is enough punishment for the bad one of the other. Put the Lorraine into equation and you got a tip of OP over similiar teams.

More arguments including module damage as a ways of crippling Lorraine, those are being said as if other tanks dont suffer module damage and as if engine damaged T-44 doesnt loose his biggest asset - mobility.

Really, the self-centered frenchtank fanboys should cut it down a notch in the forum conversations as youre begging to really piss people off.

Mediums shouldn't be able to frontally penetrate so easily, it has the same penetration as the Lowe, which already has more than any other tier 8 heavy  

Also, does it really need the last engine upgrade  ? It's so fast, it's overkill  

I think it should have about 200 pen, so it has to flank and not just unload its clip and suck its thumb for a while to reload.  Ahhh, I wish I could drive it.  

Lorraine is an ultimate hammer vs heavy tanks. They can not chase it while it reloads, they can not do more damage against her than she does, they can not erely on their armour, as the 100mm cannon penetrates a lot, especially when Lorraine flanks - and she does that with ease. I've seen a battle recently, where Lorraine from the opposing team got 11 kills on Ensk! Some of them (like me) were just guys who have met it with 250hp remaining, but when I wanted to chase reloading Lorraine, it just disappeared behind the corner, after detracking me with last shot from the current magazine. It reappeared just when it had reloaded. We both shot in the same moment. I've been destroyed. She was left with 7% and, eventually, died after killing two more of our teammates.  
Some French tanks are OP at the moment to force the people pay gold to get them faster. It seemes that they will be nerfed in some time. So did happen with E50, for example. It was very good (not really even OP), now it's not that great. So was it with some US tanks. So may it be also with French tanks.

VGA, on 07 March 2012 - 06:25 AM, said:

It uses speed to avoid getting shot since it has no armor and it is HUGE litterly it is HUGE, so it does need the alst engine.

teh 100mm has 232 pen costs 1000 credits a pop has a relaod time of 50 sec and shoots every 3.3 sec inside the revolver reload. sure it's ahrd hitting but you jsut turned yourself in a AMX 50 100 with less hp since you can effectively not be a med anymore. it takes to long to reload and fire for a med.
the 90mm has 212 pen and does the same damage as all other tier 8 meds, shoots ever 2 sec in mag and has 40 sec reload, aka now you are a med.

the lorriane can;t shoot down or up just straight on. seriously people underestimate the negative impact this has on the game.

Arty is killer, they will 1 shot you or break 90% of your tank in 1 hit, even the small ones.

every tank in game can penetrate you, litterly every tank in game.

module damage is really high and every shot to the front kills driver. every shot in the turret breaks the ring/gun/gunner/commander.


they ahve a lot of negatives to compensate the 6 shots and the speed

Arkhell, on 07 March 2012 - 03:03 PM, said:

I noticed that last night. I was parked next to an AMX50, and there was no diference in size...

Arkhell, on 07 March 2012 - 03:03 PM, said:

Last week, a Pz38 hit me twice from the rear... and damaged me. I was so stuned that I almost forgot to move...

The reload time is not as big disadvanage as many frenchie players claim to be. In any other tank, you also have moments when you backup and wait behind a building or your friends. You do not pump shot after shot for a whole battle.
Lorraine has OP penetration, it uses the same guns as her tier 9 succesor.

When I meet any other T8 tank: "Ok let's dance"

I see Lorraine: "Eeeeek somebody help meeeee before I get detracked, pinned and butchered to death"

Hammerbolt, on 07 March 2012 - 03:07 PM, said:

Size i can accept as a trade off for high firepower. It makes it less able to hide behind things.
The non existent armor is not a trade off for high firepower. The consensus on how to counter the french is that they are vulnerable to HE and that some high tier derp cannons can one shot it.
Then you look at the German line mediums and find that the only way to get decent HE damage is to trade away being able to damage any other tank and some does not even have that. Oooh but they have accuracy and penetration, two things totally irrelevant in 80% of the cases where you meet any of the clip-shooters that is not retarded and try camping on a hill at maximum distance. Soviets have less problems with the french.

Beldegrom, on 08 March 2012 - 08:41 AM, said:

the  100 mm has a 50 sec reload.... your out of the game for allmost an  entire minute. ever tried to play a med tank that can do dmg for 18 sec  (=/-3 sec between shots) and then has to hide for a minute? it's all fun  and games untill your flank gets rolled because you were still  reloading. 90mm reloads faster adn shoots faster but has normal T8 dmg.

Nargun, on 08 March 2012 - 09:22 AM, said:

random battles, see that scout tank? he can shoot trough my Lorriane.
See that pzjgr 1 that is funplatooning with that tier 8 heavy? he can shoot trough my lorriane to
lol tractor? same story
see that bizon? if he hits me i have a very high chance of loosing 1 or more crewmembers, o and i take full dmg. you know what arty i fear the most? SU-26 because it shoots so damn fast it can litterly blow my crew out in rapid succession.
people shoot at your turret, you always loose the ring/gun/gunner/commander, if one of these guys is hit your reload warps to 2 min.
people shoot in fornt plate, your driver is gone which means you are now slow without armor and frigging huge, good luck surviving.
people shoot that gigantic ass you got? ammorack is hit. loading takes 2 min good luck.

repair and med kit only get you so far if every shot takes something out.


French tanks seem to good to be true... they are because it's not true, everything breaks like mad, everything on the battlefield can damage you reliably from any angle no matter how retarded and everything on the battlefield is shooting you.

Last night, 1 shot from a Tiger II... 60% damage, dead driver, blown vision block...

markos_58, on 20 February 2012 - 03:29 PM, said:

Hammerbolt, on 20 February 2012 - 03:37 PM, said:

By your own reasoning, it would seem a 152mm HE would be able to 1 shot it

Hammerbolt, on 16 February 2012 - 04:48 PM, said:

...unless of course, someone is using smoke and mirrors to protect thier tank??

Arkhell, on 08 March 2012 - 09:33 AM, said:

OK here are 2 questions, serious ones:

1)given the choice would the french tank drivers rather have their auto canons with the burst then the long reload or no auto canon and a... 10-15 second reload (dependant on tank of course) but with exactly the same pen and dmg they have now?

Of course, i presume most will choose the auto, but that is because we overlook the armour issue.

so, question 2
2) same question as above, but you also get an armour buff, but a speed nerf if you choose the non auto reload.



EDIT: and for me the answer will be the same, i choose auto, its just so different, so much fun, it puts a smile back on face if i am having a crappy run of luck with other tanks

MadInAShed, on 08 March 2012 - 11:12 AM, said:

1) Auto loaders bring something new and fun, and i don't use the 100, i use the 90 . if you remove the auto loader and keep the tank like it is now it would be a waste of space with normal reload schemes. You ahve to admid this won't work and if you don't you are in denial)

2) removing auto loaders buffing armor and nerfing speed... depending on how much you buf and nerf we now got a German tank or a US tank without depression... so the ebst you can hope for is a german clone tree this way or a badly done US clone. not very atractive now is it.


they are balanced like ti is now, if you remove the auto loading system the tanks will be severly gimped, if you buff armor and reduce speed you get another standard tank line. think about it, the only thing special about the french tanks is that they can shoot 6 rounds at something in a short time, while the rest does steady damage.
they pay for it with everyting tehre is except speed and viewrange.

Arkhell, on 07 March 2012 - 03:03 PM, said:

lol

I have one - up to now I just had the first engine, it felt like a fast med.  I now have the second engine and it drives like a scout.  It's stupidly quick.  I still have one more engine to go ... your think it *needs* that?

Convi, on 11 January 2012 - 08:57 AM, said:

If you get sniped thats one thing, alltho you should not be taking 6 shots with an intervall of 3.3 seconds between every shot. Unless you are crossing open terrain

If you get jumped by a full HP one, one on one, nothing you can do.

If you count his shots and come out after he fired 4 or 5, nothing he can do. (you realise the reload on the last gun takes FORTY NINE seconds)