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Is AMX 13 90 worth the horrible MM it gets?


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Poll: Is AMX 13 90 worth the horrible MM it gets? (318 members have cast votes)

You have to complete 250 battles in order to participate this poll.

Is it worth to upgrade from the AMX 75?

  1. Yes (240 votes [75.47%])

    Percentage of vote: 75.47%

  2. No (44 votes [13.84%])

    Percentage of vote: 13.84%

  3. Only for those "good matches" with lower tiers (34 votes [10.69%])

    Percentage of vote: 10.69%

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Squadman45 #21 Posted 17 January 2012 - 11:06 AM

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MM is bad for the AMX 13/90 but you can do a lot more than in a Panther I, T-43 or T20 but not allways, you need some tips to use it fine in a heavy metal fight like avoid IS-4 (you only can secure damage over it in rush mode attacking his back) and if you have near a med tier 9 RUN, dont stand ooo and my favourite, try to end your attacks moving down to win speed, you need it to do 2-3 zig zags to save you.

Abonimus #22 Posted 17 January 2012 - 11:47 AM

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I dont get it why the heck do i end up being above tier 8 tanks in MM.

Whats the deal with that ? AMX 90 is supposed to be tier 7 not 8.

My AMX 90 is still stockie so its a pain in the ass =/

OpCentar #23 Posted 17 January 2012 - 12:01 PM

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Yes, MM sucks on the AMX 13/90. This weekend I had 10+ tier 9/10 battles with maybe 2 or max 3 tier 8 or below. We lost most of them, and my win % went from 65% down around 55%. The damage is wastly superior to the AMX 13/75 but still you can't do much vs 10+ tier 9/10 tanks.

I think it would be safe to adjust the battle tier from 10-13 to 9-13. Anything can penetrate the AMX13/90 even in battle tier 9 so it couldn't obliterate the enemy team all by itself.

If the Lorraine has better battle tier spread (9-11) more HP and better guns, why can't the little AMX13/90 also get some love?

smoukki #24 Posted 17 January 2012 - 12:16 PM

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Well, as far as I know, AMX is set as a "scout" in the MM chart so it gets valued as one.

For example some people even treats you as one and start complaining if you don´t rush out to lit up the enemy and die right after as your manoeuvrability isn´t as "scouty" as needed.

Please correct me I´m wrong with the MM-thing.

Abonimus #25 Posted 17 January 2012 - 12:51 PM

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Here this is just a random battle i end up being above a tier 8 medium tank in the MM.

http://i.imgur.com/IMeCF.jpg

Thats quite retarded ... Dont believe it was same on AMX 75.

Alezul #26 Posted 17 January 2012 - 01:41 PM

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View PostAbonimus, on 17 January 2012 - 12:51 PM, said:

Here this is just a random battle i end up being above a tier 8 medium tank in the MM.

http://i.imgur.com/IMeCF.jpg

Thats quite retarded ... Dont believe it was same on AMX 75.

Have you noticed the lorraine is UNDER this tank when both are on the same team? That's the first time i saw the upgrade to a tank below the tank it succeeded. It's would be like having the T-28 above the KV. I find that silly.

Abonimus #27 Posted 17 January 2012 - 04:03 PM

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View PostAlezul, on 17 January 2012 - 01:41 PM, said:

Have you noticed the lorraine is UNDER this tank when both are on the same team? That's the first time i saw the upgrade to a tank below the tank it succeeded. It's would be like having the T-28 above the KV. I find that silly.

Ye ...

Any staff member may elaborate wth is this crap ?

And ye  forget the "its a scout" idea... It aint a scout -.-

Homer_J #28 Posted 17 January 2012 - 10:18 PM

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View PostAlezul, on 17 January 2012 - 01:41 PM, said:

Have you noticed the lorraine is UNDER this tank when both are on the same team? That's the first time i saw the upgrade to a tank below the tank it succeeded. It's would be like having the T-28 above the KV. I find that silly.

Its because as a tier 7 light the AMX13-90 has the same matchmaking value as a tier 8 medium, it gets the top spot due to a quirk in the alphabet.

Same reason tier 5 lights (excluding the AMX12t) get mixed in with tier 6 mediums.

dudnic #29 Posted 18 January 2012 - 08:36 AM

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Right now I have the 13 70, and my questions are:

-what are the repair costs for the 13 90?
-how high is the ammo bill, usually?
-profit/loss an avarage match?

Alezul #30 Posted 18 January 2012 - 09:56 AM

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The AMX 90 is kinda like the tier 5 scouts of other nations. You WILL lose money if you mess around.

Repair is between 8 and 10 k credits for fully destroyed.

AP costs 250 per shell and you have 36 in total. 2.5 second reload between the 6 shots, after that 39 sec. On most games i manage to fire around 2 clips so ammo costs are easily ignored.

Profit is really crappy on my non premium account. I make around 25 k credits on a good match, 30-35 k on really good ones. If you get destroyed and use consumables, that will get you very little profit. You will have to use them to repair track or engine cause they get damaged all the time. Plus if your gunner is damage then you get 80 second reload so again you are forced to spend 3 k.

Because of the awesome gun, it's way easier to make a profit than with other scouts but still, i had matches where i emptied an entire clip into a tier 9 tank without doing anything else and only got around 17 k credits.

Squadman45 #31 Posted 18 January 2012 - 10:46 AM

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Light scouts tier 5 in non french tree are special tanks made to cover a mission in top tier battles that tier 4 lights cant do, they are "out" of game standards.

AMX13/90 is not a special tank because in HP is treated as a med tier 7 for example but suffer MM value as scout when for me is not a scout tank, yes, can scout but i dont see T20 treated as one for example and T20 is similar to AMX13/90.

For me MM in AMX13/90 is more for the revolver system because devs think that is OP when for me revolver limit a lot AMX value as scout because after 6 shoots usually in movement (you do more miss than hits) you need 40 seconds to reload and this made AMX unusefull as spotter, you need be crazy to stand with a revolver empty close to enemy if he know that you are there and you shoot at least 2-3 rounds.

If devs want mantein MM value in AMX13/90 they need at least BUFF hp to... 1150-1200, think that scouts tier 5 have at least same hp than stock tier 6 meds.

hetismij #32 Posted 18 January 2012 - 10:57 AM

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View PostAlezul, on 18 January 2012 - 09:56 AM, said:

The AMX 90 is kinda like the tier 5 scouts of other nations. You WILL lose money if you mess around.

Repair is between 8 and 10 k credits for fully destroyed.

AP costs 250 per shell and you have 36 in total. 2.5 second reload between the 6 shots, after that 39 sec. On most games i manage to fire around 2 clips so ammo costs are easily ignored.

Profit is really crappy on my non premium account. I make around 25 k credits on a good match, 30-35 k on really good ones. If you get destroyed and use consumables, that will get you very little profit. You will have to use them to repair track or engine cause they get damaged all the time. Plus if your gunner is damage then you get 80 second reload so again you are forced to spend 3 k.

Because of the awesome gun, it's way easier to make a profit than with other scouts but still, i had matches where i emptied an entire clip into a tier 9 tank without doing anything else and only got around 17 k credits.


I am not on a premium and I do make credits with the AMX13-90, not a lot, but I am certainly not losing credits with it.














The only thing that really bugs me about this tank is the incredible amount of critical hits it gets, especially engine fires (I thought it was a Diesel engine?!). I have had it happen more than once that 2 shots in a row put this tank on fire.

hetismij #33 Posted 18 January 2012 - 10:58 AM

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View PostSquadman45, on 18 January 2012 - 10:46 AM, said:

Light scouts tier 5 in non french tree are special tanks made to cover a mission in top tier battles that tier 4 lights cant do, they are "out" of game standards.

AMX13/90 is not a special tank because in HP is treated as a med tier 7 for example but suffer MM value as scout when for me is not a scout tank, yes, can scout but i dont see T20 treated as one for example and T20 is similar to AMX13/90.

For me MM in AMX13/90 is more for the revolver system because devs think that is OP when for me revolver limit a lot AMX value as scout because after 6 shoots usually in movement (you do more miss than hits) you need 40 seconds to reload and this made AMX unusefull as spotter, you need be crazy to stand with a revolver empty close to enemy if he know that you are there and you shoot at least 2-3 rounds.

If devs want mantein MM value in AMX13/90 they need at least BUFF hp to... 1150-1200, think that scouts tier 5 have at least same hp than stock tier 6 meds.


I agree with the fact that the revolver system hampers scouting. When you rush in and locate the arties, you have enough ammo to kill 2, than you are in big trouble.... As a scout/arty killer, t50-2 is still the best tank imho.

Squadman45 #34 Posted 18 January 2012 - 11:08 AM

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Yep, i very few times do the arty killer job, only when enemy team is heavy damage and i can enter in enemy base with some chance to leave it alive, for me best use of AMX13/90 is as medium tank, using cover to flank enemy, deal all damage you can and retreat before he can hit you, of course you can do tactical scout (scout for your team but with them behind you providing covering fire) but to do this i need be in a good terrain to do yoyo tactic (spot, retreat to cover, spot retreat to cover etc etc, here shoot is less important, your team is behind you to do this).

hetismij #35 Posted 18 January 2012 - 11:29 AM

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View PostSquadman45, on 18 January 2012 - 11:08 AM, said:

Yep, i very few times do the arty killer job, only when enemy team is heavy damage and i can enter in enemy base with some chance to leave it alive, for me best use of AMX13/90 is as medium tank, using cover to flank enemy, deal all damage you can and retreat before he can hit you, of course you can do tactical scout (scout for your team but with them behind you providing covering fire) but to do this i need be in a good terrain to do yoyo tactic (spot, retreat to cover, spot retreat to cover etc etc, here shoot is less important, your team is behind you to do this).


For me it's roughly the same. On some maps I like playing the tactical scout (Malinovka is great for that!), but usually I use it a bit like a medium, but slightly different. I use it more as a support tanks for heavies. I might wait for one of our heavies to engage an enemy heavy, than race to get behind the enemy, empty my clip and retreat again. In a Med I would just keep jumping from cover to cover.

Tig3rEnte #36 Posted 18 January 2012 - 01:28 PM

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View PostAlezul, on 17 January 2012 - 01:41 PM, said:

Have you noticed the lorraine is UNDER this tank when both are on the same team? That's the first time i saw the upgrade to a tank below the tank it succeeded. It's would be like having the T-28 above the KV. I find that silly.

indeed. i skipped all frenchies till t6: drove the amx 13 75, amx 13 90 and currently the Lorraine.
Never complained about the MM in general but on this particular Tank i join the club.
The amx 13 90 has flawed MM period. Being placed over the Lorraine when paired together is just ridiculous.

With Top Gun it can still be competetive up to T10 or fill the Scout role when needed but still,
the MM needs to be adjusted or the Tank flagged as "Medium".
Stats wise both amx 13 were kinda same for me, but with barely 150 games i consider it Statistical Variance.

On a Sidenote, the Lorraine is just a Dream come true, and my subjective impression is that it gets the same MM as the amx 13 90, while being considerable more powered and that seems odd.

Maybe put this Thread in general Forum, cos i doubt it gets the AMount of attention required in this sub.

Abonimus #37 Posted 19 January 2012 - 11:34 AM

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View PostTig3rEnte, on 18 January 2012 - 01:28 PM, said:

indeed. i skipped all frenchies till t6: drove the amx 13 75, amx 13 90 and currently the Lorraine.
Never complained about the MM in general but on this particular Tank i join the club.
The amx 13 90 has flawed MM period. Being placed over the Lorraine when paired together is just ridiculous.

With Top Gun it can still be competetive up to T10 or fill the Scout role when needed but still,
the MM needs to be adjusted or the Tank flagged as "Medium".
Stats wise both amx 13 were kinda same for me, but with barely 150 games i consider it Statistical Variance.

On a Sidenote, the Lorraine is just a Dream come true, and my subjective impression is that it gets the same MM as the amx 13 90, while being considerable more powered and that seems odd.

Maybe put this Thread in general Forum, cos i doubt it gets the AMount of attention required in this sub.


I agree completely.

Its quite weired.

Would be nice if it was moved to general forum tho ye.

hiroshi_tea #38 Posted 20 January 2012 - 04:48 AM

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Quote

Have you noticed the lorraine is UNDER this tank when both are on the same team? That's the first time i saw the upgrade to a tank below the tank it succeeded. It's would be like having the T-28 above the KV. I find that silly.
Lorraine is only under the AMX 13 90 simply because of alphabetisation.  Both of them are considered tier 8s on the roster, and thus they are sorted by names.  A comes before L

You can see this also with the Chaffee.  the roster considers it a tier 6 like the other end game tier 5 lights - but the Chaffee is always at the top (above the other tier 5 end game lights and above easy 8s and such) because C is a very early letter in the alphabet

marcusanton #39 Posted 17 February 2012 - 02:27 PM

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View Posthiroshi_tea, on 20 January 2012 - 04:48 AM, said:

Lorraine is only under the AMX 13 90 simply because of alphabetisation.  Both of them are considered tier 8s on the roster, and thus they are sorted by names.  A comes before L

You can see this also with the Chaffee.  the roster considers it a tier 6 like the other end game tier 5 lights - but the Chaffee is always at the top (above the other tier 5 end game lights and above easy 8s and such) because C is a very early letter in the alphabet

1/ according to MM setup, AMX13/90 is considered a tier VIII even though rated at VII
2/ as it is a light, it's battle table is more of a tier VIII/IX than tier VII.
3/ don't complain. It over performs as it is and will get nerfed. it really does over perform.

To sum it up, it's quite nimble, fast, high natural camo value, powerful gun with burst option. It cannot stand a beating, but!, it's not meant to. So if you play the slugfest, you're doing it wrong. If you play to AMX strengths, it's fun tank to play and with a premium account also quite profitable.

Also, it's really good at pissing off the hard'n'heavy players in high tiered TDs and SPGs :P

kymrel #40 Posted 17 February 2012 - 02:40 PM

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Personally I didn't really enjoy the AMX 13 90 because of the matchmaking. I didn't play it as a scout, I played it as a med. Now that I have the Lorraine mostly upgraded I find it so much better. Not all enemy teams have loads of tier 9 or 10 and I actually feel useful even against those with over 200mm penetration (I stick to the 90 mm gun for now).




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