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M24 Chaffee vs. French LT5 - LT7


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saml6131 #21 Posted 19 February 2012 - 07:41 PM

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View PostVolatile_Squirrel, on 19 February 2012 - 06:19 PM, said:

AMX 12t and AMX 13/75 are both inferior to Chaffee.

I'll keep my Chaffee and continue to play it now and then in hope for brighter tomorrow... which might look something like this: M41
Chaffee is better than the AMX 12t but the AMX13 75 is better. Deals more damage with more penetration and with its cylinder reloading means that you can kill it in one reload. Its has 100 more hit points than the Chaffee, enough to take another shot in a duel, can't run away or flank it as it is faster and has a really high turret traverse speed and it earns more credits. The Chaffee can win in a fight if the driver is good, but the AMX13 75 is a better tank.

The Bulldog wouldn't be much of an upgrade for all the additional things it would have to deal with. The speed increase is probably the only upgrade worth it. Gun would probably only have a penetration increase and the matchmaking would only get worse as well as the credits.

Volatile_Squirrel #22 Posted 20 February 2012 - 12:02 PM

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And there comes this guy killing my hopes. You evil, EVIL man!

Hmm... how bout this than: http://www.toadmanst....com/t42_01.jpg ???

Stumbled on this baby while browsing forums.

saml6131 #23 Posted 20 February 2012 - 12:23 PM

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View PostVolatile_Squirrel, on 20 February 2012 - 12:02 PM, said:

And there comes this guy killing my hopes. You evil, EVIL man!

Hmm... how bout this than: http://www.toadmanst....com/t42_01.jpg ???

Stumbled on this baby while browsing forums.
Not trying to kill your hopes, but it isn't even in the tech tree and I doubt War Gaming are going to add anything else onto it unless they do start creating tier 6 light tank premiums as the Type 62 is.

But I cannot find anything on this new tank you have shown me. It looks like a Patton but with an AMX turret, in which case it would probably have to be premium due to the multiple factions involvment in the tank.

I'm fine with my Chaffee. I can still get multiple Top guns and high experience battle's in it. All it needs is a top speed buff so it can go faster than a heavy tank and it will be fine.

Volatile_Squirrel #24 Posted 20 February 2012 - 02:11 PM

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This one clearly has only five roadwheels while my Patton has six.
So I would say this might be M41 hull with oscilating turret. And not AMX version but some American prototype which qualifies it for normal tech tree.

For more info maybe this might help: http://forum.worldof...us-heavy-route/

But I am getting off topic. Apologies.

theghostcat #25 Posted 20 February 2012 - 02:32 PM

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To the OP:

Yes I think it is, and mainly  for the reasons others has addressed:

(tier spread/end of the line, and simply out classed)

I recently sold my chaffee. Why? the Amx13/75 was cheaper to maintain - I'm pretty sure the french tanks bounce more shots then the chaffee as well  <_<

3 Thinks could save the chaffee, put it wear it belongs - tier 6, increase its HP to match french tier 6/7 tanks, and removed that stupid end of the line penalty.

saml6131 #26 Posted 20 February 2012 - 05:33 PM

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View PostVolatile_Squirrel, on 20 February 2012 - 02:11 PM, said:

This one clearly has only five roadwheels while my Patton has six.
So I would say this might be M41 hull with oscilating turret. And not AMX version but some American prototype which qualifies it for normal tech tree.

For more info maybe this might help: http://forum.worldof...us-heavy-route/

But I am getting off topic. Apologies.
Meh, you can dream whatever tank you want. It's whether or not War Gaming will add it to the game. Personally I think it would be too alike compared to the tanks currently in the Full US tree, and they also do have a full tree. If they add anything else to it then it will be over 1-2 years before you get the tank due to everything else they will need to add.

I personally want the British tanks, but I still got to wait sometime this year for them to arrive. Who knows when but until then I need to use the closest thing I got to them which is the Premium Churchill. Closest thing to yours is either the Chaffee, the Patton or one of the French AMX's with the same Oscillating turret.

As this is going off topic I will not continue with this conversation just so you know that I'm not ignoring you. Take care.

saml6131 #27 Posted 20 February 2012 - 05:40 PM

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View Posttheghostcat, on 20 February 2012 - 02:32 PM, said:

To the OP:

Yes I think it is, and mainly  for the reasons others has addressed:

(tier spread/end of the line, and simply out classed)

I recently sold my chaffee. Why? the Amx13/75 was cheaper to maintain - I'm pretty sure the french tanks bounce more shots then the chaffee as well  <_<

3 Thinks could save the chaffee, put it wear it belongs - tier 6, increase its HP to match french tier 6/7 tanks, and removed that stupid end of the line penalty.

I agree with your points but also think one more should be added. The health is terribly low. Enough so that it can be one shot by some of the tanks it is up against and then a large repair bill for a tier 5 tanks credit income afterwards isn't anymore fun. I still can earn credits in it either with premium or if you don't get shot. Easier said than done as it is terribly slow enough for heavy tanks to race past it. And that brings me to my point, increase the top speed. Both other end tier 5 light tanks have a top speed of 72kph and they don't even exist.

Highway_Star #28 Posted 20 February 2012 - 09:58 PM

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IMO, these high tier French lights should become mediums instead. I often see light tanks on the minimap and think "it's only a light, no big deal". Then I discover it's a Frenchie and his machine-cannon. It's got the firepower of a medium so it should be classed as a medium.

Not sure if the Chaffee also falls into this catagory.

allufewig #29 Posted 22 February 2012 - 04:34 PM

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Played the Chaffe for over 700 matches and the three AMXs for about 300 together.

As a pure (Bush-)Scout, only the 1390 can match the Chaffee. It trades the M24s ability to turn on the spot for a smaller silhouette while both have the same viewrange. When it comes to fighting, Chaffee is maybe slightly beaten even by the 1375 overall, but not when engaging small targets on the move. This is still a Chaffee-job, as the frenchs wont even hit the colloquial barndoor then.

The 1390 outclasses the Chaffe by far in hitpoints and weaponry, but after all its a tier7. Thats more than fair, i think. On the other hand, the AMX12t doesnt stand a Chance against the Chaffee in any aspect.


The AMX-line has two good arguments for it going though. They will earn you money along the path to the excellent Lorraine and BatChat 25t.

CandyVanMan #30 Posted 23 February 2012 - 03:13 PM

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As a scout, I feel the Chaffee is till the superior choice, even after the introduction of French tanks, but the AMX 13 90 is overall a better tank due to better damage application.

Gigaton #31 Posted 23 February 2012 - 06:02 PM

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Out of curiosity, why do you feel Chaffee is better scout? Just because of the lower matchmaking weight?

IMO, AMX 13/90's top speed, hitpoints and armament eclipse M24 my such large margin that M24's slight advantage in handling and better accuracy on move are non-issues. AMX 13/90 is basically a tier 7 Chaffee, just without the nonsencial repair cost.

Chaffee had never worked as scout to me, in fact I find I'm doing bit better with it now that I'm playing it as E8. I try to hang back for a while in the start until I see opportunity to use my firepower (the main feature of Chaffee). Chaffee might work as passive scout, but the top speed is too slow to get into good spots before French high tier lights and meds (or even T-50-2 and VK28 before 7.1).

Ofc, that might change if they nerf engine power, passability and view range of the AMX 13 90s in 7.2 (like only 300-380 view range for the AMX-13 series, and possibly Lorraine and Batchat too). If they don't nerf AMX 13/90 to oblivion, then tier 5 light repair cost has to go. Especially since it has been confirmed that T-50-2 is being rehought or replaced by something far less zippy, hence the only true scout is getting boot from the game leaving only the French in their place.

CandyVanMan #32 Posted 23 February 2012 - 06:14 PM

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View PostGigaton, on 23 February 2012 - 06:02 PM, said:

Out of curiosity, why do you feel Chaffee is better scout? Just because of the lower matchmaking weight?

IMO, AMX 13/90's top speed, hitpoints and armament eclipse M24 my such large margin that M24's slight advantage in handling and better accuracy on move are non-issues. AMX 13/90 is basically a tier 7 Chaffee, just without the nonsencial repair cost.

Chaffee had never worked as scout to me, in fact I find I'm doing bit better with it now that I'm playing it as E8. I try to hang back for a while in the start until I see opportunity to use my firepower (the main feature of Chaffee). Chaffee might work as passive scout, but the top speed is too slow to get into good spots before French high tier lights and meds (or even T-50-2 and VK28 before 7.1).

Ofc, that might change if they nerf engine power, passability and view range of the AMX 13 90s in 7.2 (like only 300-380 view range for the AMX-13 series, and possibly Lorraine and Batchat too). If they don't nerf AMX 13/90 to oblivion, then tier 5 light repair cost has to go. Especially since it has been confirmed that T-50-2 is being rehought or replaced by something far less zippy, hence the only true scout is getting boot from the game leaving only the French in their place.
I agree that the repair cost of tier 5 lights need to go, but AMX 13 90 will always replace the spot of a tier 8 medium, so he should not be in the role of a pure scout, unlike the Chaffee.
Chaffee also shits insane amounts of xp in high tier games! :D

Czef #33 Posted 23 February 2012 - 06:15 PM

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1 vs 1 Chaffee wins with both 12t and 13 75, but almost no chance against 13 90. Chaffee may have less hitpoints and damage per shot that 13 75, but, it has superior on the move accuracy, and in dogfight on short range M24 will hit french almost every single time, while AMX will miss some of it shots. Also it looks for me that Chaffee is more agaile, you can fool the AMX by fast direction changes and turning around quickly. 13 90 is just too much, well it's tier 7 and Chaffee is tier 5 so don't expect miracles here.

Gigaton #34 Posted 23 February 2012 - 06:22 PM

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View Postlosvar, on 23 February 2012 - 06:14 PM, said:

I agree that the repair cost of tier 5 lights need to go, but AMX 13 90 will always replace the spot of a tier 8 medium, so he should not be in the role of a pure scout, unlike the Chaffee.

My point was that Chaffee is 75% combat tank, 25% scout itself (it can still damage pretty much everyone except IS-4 and 7). Which is basically what the AMX 13 90 is as well. Hence AMX 13 90 is tier 7 Chaffee (it even gets the same elevated matchmaking as tier 5 lights).

theghostcat #35 Posted 23 February 2012 - 06:32 PM

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The problem is the chaffee really should be a tier 7 tank.

And I'm mainly thinking timeline here - having it come off the T20 rather then the M5.

For game play it should pretty much be tier 6/7 as well. Buff its HP a bit -and remove the stupid end of the line repair penalty.

Right now its handicapped BECAUSE its a tier 5 light in every respect - it just has move down sides them upsides - made even more evident by the intro of the frog tanks.

saml6131 #36 Posted 23 February 2012 - 07:28 PM

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Just played a game in my Chaffee. It was on Cliff and as usual I went to the hill overlooking the left passage where both teams tend to be at a standoff. What happened when I got there? I got shot, twice before I managed to make it back into cover. An AMX13 75 had beaten me there due to its superior speed, got one shot on me and although I reacted almost insantly and was right next to cover he shot me again. I lost half my health by now and was asking for help from my teammates. A friendly E8 sherman drove across, only to get caught in crossfire and ended up next to me with 68 hitpoints remaining. Next thing I know, the AMX is rushing us. HE fires on shot and kills the Sherman. At this point he has 3 shots remaining. And I know it. I got one shot on him. He finished me off with both shots and one to spare, should he have missed. I lost money that game. He gained a lot. And my average experience with the Chaffee is 577xp non premium. I am usually a good player to have on the team depending on the matchmaking.

Just thought I'd throw that in to give you another view on the Chaffee vs AMX13 75.

Also for anyone who uses the Chaffee that wants some tips, here is something you can do. Wait. That's right. Stay at your base and defend your arty from incoming enemy scouts. This is quite valuable depending on what arty you have and how many of them you have. But the main thing for you to do is wait until the enemy has less tanks. When about half their team (So 7-8 tanks) are remaining, then is your time to strike. As with all Light tanks they work pretty good halfway throughout the game as there are less enemy tanks available so it is easier to do specific things such as breaching their defences to kill arty and cap, flanking heavies as they will not have any (or as much) support, most medium tanks remaining will be damaged enough for you to finish them off and spotting can be even more crucial. Most people know where the enemy tanks are near the first few minutes of a game, halfway through however, they could be anywhere on the map. Its just one of the things you can do. Experiment and find out other things. These high tier light tanks are still new to most people.

theghostcat #37 Posted 23 February 2012 - 09:22 PM

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View Postsaml6131, on 23 February 2012 - 07:28 PM, said:


When about half their team (So 7-8 tanks) are remaining, then is your time to strike.

Not that I disagree with you - in fact I don't -

but that's the problem w/ the chaffee - I don't feel it influences the game as much as it should - it's now relegated to late game support or clean up - after the battle has already been decided - placing the win or loses is in the hands of your team mates...even more so then usual!

CandyVanMan #38 Posted 23 February 2012 - 09:25 PM

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View Posttheghostcat, on 23 February 2012 - 09:22 PM, said:

Not that I disagree with you - in fact I don't -

but that's the problem w/ the chaffee - I don't feel it influences the game as much as it should - it's now relegated to late game support or clean up - after the battle has already been decided - placing the win or loses is in the hands of your team mates...even more so then usual!
If your team is somewhat good, then you can greatly influence the outcome.
Never underestimate a hidden Chaffee on the front with binocs.

saml6131 #39 Posted 23 February 2012 - 10:09 PM

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View Postlosvar, on 23 February 2012 - 09:25 PM, said:

If your team is somewhat good, then you can greatly influence the outcome.
Never underestimate a hidden Chaffee on the front with binocs.

Yep, I have binoculars on my Chaffee as well as a camo net. Works just the way you said, but it is quite risky as you do not know when you are spotted in which case it would be time to get the hell out of there. Main reason I'm looking forward to 0.7.2 is because of the commander perk that lets you know when you've been spotted.

View Posttheghostcat, on 23 February 2012 - 09:22 PM, said:

Not that I disagree with you - in fact I don't -

but that's the problem w/ the chaffee - I don't feel it influences the game as much as it should - it's now relegated to late game support or clean up - after the battle has already been decided - placing the win or loses is in the hands of your team mates...even more so then usual!

I completely understand what you are saying. It's one of the reasons I would have said about just waiting until halfway through the game. Its too weak to tank shots, the gun is good when you can penetrate easily but useless against tier 8+ heavies from the front, it is too slow to be used for suicide scouting (and surviving it) and most tanks have the similar view ranges. It doesn't feel much of an important tank, but when it is used to its very full extend, you can really help out your team even at higher tiers. That top gun I got for my Chaffee? I got it in a tier 10 battle where we had 4 tanks remaining and they had 8. Even the smallest tanks can do big things.

Arallaw #40 Posted 24 February 2012 - 09:09 AM

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OT:

View PostGigaton, on 23 February 2012 - 06:22 PM, said:

(it can still damage pretty much everyone except IS-4 and 7)

Actually, IS-4's and 7's roofs are weak. You can open these cans with Chaffee's AP ammo. ;)




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